MvC3 Actual Balance/Potential Tiers Discussion

[ThisGuileKillYa]

More assists should reset you in a standing position. To my knowledge, Spencer-B is the only one that actually does (or the only one that people actually use) so nobody’s ready for the standing state reset possibilities. I’m hoping that at least 1 of the new 36 assists will hold the opponent standing because I really don’t like playing Spencer, but stuff like this is so filthy.

I agree with every word of this part, right down to the “I really don’t like playing Spencer.” Ive gone on record as saying I’m almost more excited about the 36 new assists than the 12 new characters. I was hopin’ for a new beam, but a new stand-reset assist would be great too. Wild prediction: Rocket Raccoon will have an assist that lots of people will complain about, and I will likely abuse, especially if he plays like a furry BB Hood, as Seth has said he does J

[SteelyHawke]

I fought a second lord Thor user today who had Iron Man and Wesker on his team. Blowing up his Wesker and Iron man wasn’t that hard, but watching poor Thor struggle for a hit was pretty sad stuff. It was my first match against a Thor player in months.

Dude needs some attention…

So what you can’t kill someone in one combo from Hsien-Ko? Marvel might be all about getting that first hit and ending it with death, but what a lot of people forget is that the reality is: Getting that first hit is the most important thing, and whether you want to accept it or not, if you’ve gotten it once, chances are you’ll get it again seeing as now you can either reset or mix up after the combo. Yeah, she’s certainly lower than someone like Joe, but she’s at least on par with Ryu and Captain America under the ‘extremely limited options’ tier.

The fact that I can’t kill someone in a single combo is a good thing. More characters need to be reigned in on the damage front. The problem is that a good normal like j.H turns solid damage(at best) into pretty shit damage in a game where not killing high tier characters means death.

Also, the argument about getting that hit first doesn’t apply to Hsien-Ko. Getting the first hit is a matter of knowing the matchup and being insanely lucky. Whether or not you will hit again depends on how laughably bad your opponent is and how little matchup experience they have against her.

Oh, and don’t you even dare to put Ryu in the same category as her. He has a level 3, good damage, a solid dash, a great entry tool from the air, a BEAM HYPER(this single thing alone almost guarantees a bump in tier placement) that has different directions/ground bounces/OTGs as well, a solid projectile game, great DHC/THC options and great XF bonuses.

[Noble_Cactus]

No.

Just…no. Especially considering she doesn’t have anything that could really be called resets or mixups, considering how epically slow she is. There is no way that she’s not the worst character in the game, really.

Well, you can mixup with a projectile assist and her teledash/pendulum, but then again, that requires an assist, and she should be able to mixup with the tools she has anyway but can’t, so…

As for j.H, yeah, it scales so badly. In fact, her scaling in general is pretty screwed up.

The only reason Thor is C Tier if not C- Tier in my book is because of that MIGHTY HELMET. I mean damn… could it look any more ridiculous?

What about the Mighty Speech?

[xesaie]

Thor is the classic example of ‘theory good’. He lags behind in every significant way except health and damage (both of which really don’t matter that much in Vanilla). He has a number of what should be good tools, but they don’t mesh together well or work quite as well as they should.

When the only way you see a character is as the standard for TOD combos, that’s a hint of a problem

[DevilJin_01]

AE Ibuki isn’t that good of a character any way. At least not in comparison to how good of a character Dante or Magneto are in MVC3. Dante and Magneto would be banned from other fighting games. AE Ibuki is just another SFIV style character that relies on random and has no footsies because her character type is set to have slow walk speed and limited ranged footsies. Which leaves little reason to pick her over Akuma who has more guaranteed vortex situations any way.

[Maverick8]

I am actually a fan of XF but this set (http://frame-advantage.com/video/marvel-vs-capcom-3/8-on-the-break-124/masta-cj-vs-10stars/4041) demonstrates that it is ridiculous. Sure Wesker is OP already but the damage boost and most notably the duration of XF3 is insanely broken.

There are plenty of other things wrong with this match and 10Stars made several mistakes to lose the match BUT I was still disgusted watching him lose like that. Should’ve snapped that scumbag in I guess. Marvel 3 is such a punishing game and I like that to a degree but the duration on XF3 is just far too long for the damage it’s putting out. UMvC3 isn’t addressing the duration I’ve seen/heard/read but hopefully it’ll change these situations.

That was a sick counter by CJ at the end of the last game.

[El_Maiz]

I don’t understand how Wekser or Wolverine do more damage than Hulk, and Hulk doesn’t have a teleport, or any good way to mix up.

[KJunk]

I don’t understand how Wekser or Wolverine do more damage than Hulk, and Hulk doesn’t have a teleport, or any good way to mix up.

Hulk does do some nice damage in the right conditions. If he’s near a corner, you can lose 900k+ for a 1 meter combo. If he’s just doing magic series -> OTG super, then yeah it’s lackluster.

I like watching Kuuronn’s hulk because he makes it work anywhere. Don’t get hit by the strongest there is.

[FlyingVe]

Hulk also DHC’s well because his basic spelling combo as so few hits.

[Duck_Strong]

Hulk doesn’t spell very well though. He always forgets a B or C.

[FlyingVe]

Spelling is for scrubs.

[Mallrat]

I don’t understand how Wekser or Wolverine do more damage than Hulk, and Hulk doesn’t have a teleport, or any good way to mix up.

I’ve wondered the same deal with Haggar and Thor about this. Although I’ve heard rumors that Haggar’s new OTG is actually good, and he can relaunch without assists so that has to lead to damage. Also it apparently let’s him follow up after air grabs, any command grab and his Level 3 Grab like Ghost Rider can.

And Thor has that… wait has Thor gotten any buffs at all?!

[FullMetalRoss]

Thor apparently has a new move, but there is no video of it. Also Grabs have increased range and mighty spark startup is reported to be faster.

[shinquickman]

In UMVC3, you can perform a TAC after hitting with a non-normal attack in the air. You can’t do this in Vanilla. Is there any significance to this?

[Icytor]

Not that were aware of. If haggar can cancel the OTG then it will be good. And for Thor, i defintly think the only thing he needs to make him so much better is faster normals, just that one thing will bump him up.

[AceKillah]

If you think you character has trash normals looks at viper players go into training mode with Thor and do his 2A…you now feel 20x better about your character your welcome.

[tastylumpia]

Yeah, TBH Viper has some decent pokes. c.M has some range, j.H/S are good for jump-ins and s.L is a standing low.

[FlyingVe]

2B’s hurt box extends before the hitbox and has awful recovery, it looks good at first, but it really isn’t. Her jumping L is her best jumpin in my opinion.

[El_Maiz]

Don’t forget that rather than it being good that her St. L hits low, it’s bad that her Cr. L doesn’t, because st. L has no range.

[Chrisis]

Normals of Viper’s that I like:

Ground:
5A: Very fast hits low
5C: Heavy hit stun, good for linking between things especially against aerial opponents.
6B: Under rated, goes over the vast majority of lows in the game, can cross up, can be cancelled for weird situations.

Air:
A: Best cross up, lowest block stun for scary high low throw mix ups
C: Converts anywhere on the screen into damage
S: Least terrible hitbox.

Everything else I have some major gripe with