Narrowing just to four games is very hard to do people…you say do this but once again you dont realize the problem…there are an abundance of good games to choose from…
In Capcom mainly you all have ST, 3s, CVS2, MVC2…and Alpha as a side tournament at times…
No problem there is it?? You dont have as many options as we do hence narrowing it down is not hard…
If we were to narrow it down to just 4 games lets see here someone is gonna bitch immediately…
Garou, KOF98, KOFXI, SST, Real Bout 2…
Hmm wheres World Heroes Perfect? Wheres the 3d KOF? Where’s Breakers Revenge? Wheres NGBC??? Wheres 2k2/NeoWave??
Get my point…Hence my formula hits ALL THOSE AREAS 98% of the time. As Ralph says if you got time to run more why not???
Not the mosy practical option…its ideal right now but not practical…
Its a problem of having so many good fighting games to play from SNK…a problem to be honest I ENJOY…Stops boredom…
Can be proven to be better then the rest of the established cast- like a SS tier. Thinking Duo lon 2k3 where I think only one SBO finalist team didn’t have Duo lon in it.
Then again, I think a lack of character diversity in tournies is a sign that a game is broken.
The chars I am worried about for this are, in order of concern: Orochi Iori, Orochi Leona, Orochi, Nightmare Geese, Goenitz. Note: worried about does not mean ban immediately, it means test a bit before allowing.
As for KOF- how hard is it to cut it down to 2?
The only old-school KOFs that aren’t considered completely broke are 95,98, and 02, and no one plays 95, so it’s a choice between 98 and 02. Given a choice between 98 and 02- more people will be unhappy if it’s 02 (most of the 02 lovers don’t hate 98 the way 98 lovers hate 02), and there’s UM coming out for a new port, so go with 98
For new KOF, XI is considered the best of the bunch, so keep XI until XII comes, then play both, and then keep the better game between XI and XII.
The FF and SS games of choice are harder choices, since there’s a more even split between RBSP and RB2, and SSII and SST. (I prefer RB2 and SS2 given those choices)
Because, they leave the window open just in case a scrub picks him, and then they can provide him epic shame by beating Akuma with a regular character. Same applies to O.Sagat. Beating Choi’s O.Sagat with regular Guile is a good example of this sorta thing.
snk and america just dont mix. I play only snk games with the exception of melty blood. Most americans play snk games and just dont like them. Thats just the way it is. It really sucks for me cause thats all i play.
When i first started playing samurai shodown 5 i would study asian matches and they didnt really make sense to me cause it seemed they where playing a very defensive style. But as i got better i began to understand more and more what was going on. It is at the piont now where i can watch a samurai shodown match and know exactly why a person does every move. So the reason why asian tatics are emulated is they are just way ahead of usa in snk games. They have way bigger snk community and its very alive like SF here.
As far as infinites, it all comes down to honor. Some poeple play games and only play to win, wining is all that matters to them. SO they will do what ever they can to win (matching up,picking cheap characters, using infinites ect ect). What i have learned is you will never be respected as a player if you dont play with some honor. Otherwise kids will say well he just got cheap and picked blah blah, or he just picks characters that beat mine. SO what im trying to say is to truly be a great video game player you must play with honor and great skill or you will never get any sort of respect. ANd i belive that aplies for every game that is played.
ps. being a ss5 player i have played maybe the cheapest bosses in any game(yumeji,sankuro) and still beat them with legal characters. SO where there is a will, there is a way.
Seems to me that single elim strengthens mental toughness better then anything. I mean if we look at 3S evo, our top american players got peaced out to the japanese, not just cause they know the game better and the mind games, but because that format is so common over there, like you said.
It probably is that format that makes them better, they adapt quicker because they have no choice.
I agree that we should take things apart and learn things ourselves, but these top players from other countries are solid in ways where they innovate these weird mind game block strings. Dakou and Xiaohai are notorious for this in 98, and its interesting to watch, also really helpful to bite off of. A lot of those guys inspired me to pick up chars I didn’t care about before.
Lets also consider that these players have been playing for ages, and they just have searched out some of the best methods of what to do. Having copied this mindset to a lesser extent (much), its helped my game considerably, and I’m improving more these days then before, cause I had no clue. I’ll let people argue who is better when I’m being innovated by watching it all.
For example my 98 Yamazaki, who I am pretty decent with offline picked up ideas from older pak players who centered there game around building meter via cancel, and the guy has some great block strings, fake outs and his sA stops so much shit if you time it properly, also his sD is a really amazing poke and covers a lot of area.
People widely underestimate yama’s usefulness, sure he isn’t top tier at poking like Daimon is, but he can hold his own anyways.
I like to pretty much study every method thats good, its easy to tell whats not good as Emil has mentioned before, the lack of freshness or repeating a very obvious block string over and over. For me the hardest lesson to learn in KOF is knowing when to guard and when not to. So over all, we need to contribute more as american players, I mean we don’t contribute enough really useful strategy to the international scene because we don’t have the competition that demands it from us, so we level up a whole lot slower. For example; I got good with max mode in 2002 because when I originally was playing this mexican player who would consistently land 100% type shit, I kept playing him and he called me a copy cat, but we had some really fun matches. That was a awesome day to learn things. That was years ago though.
I’m thinking GGPO may be the saving grace for us americans when it blows up more, because no matter what we host at evo, its not gonna bring those international players who REALLY REALLY shine in these games stateside. Sure we all want to see it happen, and I do attend evo worlds, so maybe next year we’ll get more lucky.
The best american kof players are online players, its ignorant for me to state, I admit, but I am in cali and I play a lot of these chinese, and they don’t hold a candle to some of the sickness that some of these mame players are throwing down now. So cal had a great KOF scene at super arcade back in 2000.
Also to the post that mentions honor, I say fuck honor, if its abusive learn it, so it happens to you, its in your arsenal. Learn 100%'s, learn infinites, learn all things with those characters you dedicate to.
Infinites in 98 and 2002 are generally way hard anyways, so no worries, the 2001 bullshit factor isn’t in effect as much.
Too many games is probably why the UFGL will never happen. Cutting down on the amount of games will help a lot. Some said it before in the thread, Really, what’s the point of having a waku waku 7 tourney?? Just push the BETTER games more fleshed out games. 4 main games would be good imo. A “kof” game (kof98, kof2k2, Mira, KOFXI, NGBC), an SS game (SS2, SS5sp, SS6), and FF game (umm most likely Garou, everyone likes it), and one of the old school games (WHP, FHD, Breakers). If you have too many games, a lot of people won’t even bother trying to play, just narrow it down and bring some order. You’re seen as the leader of this whole movement here in the US, so take a poll, flip coins etc, just decide on which games hold at tournies.
If they keep the same system for MIRA, then MI3 on a next gen system is going to blow up big when people realize that they game is not only a solid fighter but a really fun game as well.
Honor in video games = Lose.
Consistent Wins = Respect.
If you want to play for fun, you shouldnt enter tournaments (if you are serious about winning anyways).
Anyways,
I think a good line up could be:
Kof 98 um
Kof xi/ xii
Motw
One more good misc snk game (breakers , ect, ect.)
just an opinion of course. Are people talking about throwing a snk game exclusive tournament or trying to get them added to “big tournament” line ups?? If its the latter , i think the game should be narrowed down to one MABEY 2 that people could play and look forward to seeing at big events. I think if the community votes and decides on 1/2 games that will be the standard, more people would be will to play and learn. Its really going to come down to the snk leaders/directors/ ect having to piss a few people off (by not having “their” game) for the greater good of the snk community.
ok well i dont know how this forum works but some one left me soem feed back i think is really funny. I said
As far as infinites, it all comes down to honor. Some poeple play games and only play to win, wining is all that matters to them. SO they will do what ever they can to win (matching up,picking cheap characters, using infinites ect ect). What i have learned is you will never be respected as a player if you dont play with some honor. Otherwise kids will say well he just got cheap and picked blah blah, or he just picks characters that beat mine. SO what im trying to say is to truly be a great video game player you must play with honor and great skill or you will never get any sort of respect. ANd i belive that aplies for every game that is played.
ps. being a ss5 player i have played maybe the cheapest bosses in any game(yumeji,sankuro) and still beat them with legal characters. SO where there is a will, there is a way.
and they left me this feedback
Cheap? Honor? This isn’t the 90s.
what? the 90s ? so people played with more honor then or something. I didnt say something like The word “rad” so whats so 90s about playign with honor? I dont mean to offend im just kinda confused.
also can some one tell me what this “money” thing is in my profile, thanks and srry for any off topic or maybe something rude i might have said.
as far as all the games i play you can play with honor and still be the best
. I have enterd about 6 tournaments and i come in 1st or 2nd every time so your post is irrelavent to me. Not saying they where huge tournaments but still tournaments.
Aside from one random scrub in Orlando who can barely throw fireballs, I haven’t heard people actually say “cheap” and “honor” in fighting games since tick-throws might get you into a fist fight, IE, the 90s.
The truth…winning gets you respect…for those that call shit cheap and other stuff like that to which Josh alludes to in this thread they dont deserve to play in tournaments. I dont have any remorse for people that bitch all the time…
Winners find ways to win…losers find ways to lose…which includes making excuses…bitching…saying “The only way you won is because of such and such cheap tactic.”
“How can you feel good about yourself using that character?”
Winners find ways to win…losers find ways to lose…
Im not trying to be a dick but, noone on srk cares about the “big fishes in little ponds” that float around and randomly post. I have won tournaments in colorado, new mexico, and omaha, noone cares lol. All I was trying to say is that your “play with honor attitude” will be detrimental to your process of becoming a top player when its all said and done. You can have your morals, everyone else will be working towards real respect from the fighting game community thru wins and good games.
Casual gamer attitude and tournament attitude are two separate things.
Playing to win vs. Playing for fun is totally separate.
Playing to win means looking for whatever edge you can get…loving losing because that will only make you stronger…working hard to getting better…taking control of your own learning…NOT BEING A LAZY ASS about research, studying fighting game vids, strategy, spending money TO LOSE TO BETTER PLAYERS… getting out of your hole and travelling…
Playing for fun means at times bitching when you get hit by an infinite…
Not taking anything seriously…
Not tapping the potential of the game… Not playing for glory, respect and money on the line in tournaments…
But you can do both…
Its just overall two different agendas…and I’ve realized casual and hardcore gamers at times dont really mix…Because their goals are too drastically different…
