Looked painfully slow

[otori]

It does look painfully slow and the knockdowns seem to last way too long

I see some of the same errors in SFIV being repeated

[tali]

It does look painfully slow and the knockdowns seem to last way too long

I see some of the same errors in SFIV being repeated

Another sf4 error you will see repeated is all of us buying it and playing it and complaining about it

[Maxman]

I think that, we all need to give this game a chance :3
I think this game looks really good for something thats in its early stages

Plus I believe this is the same build that was shown from Capcom Cup, who knows, maybe they are already at work addressing this common complaint ? I think we need to till E3 (if Capcom doesn’t roll out any new trailers till E3) to see how the game has evolved

Just my 2 cents :3

[Cestus]

Sadly SFXT was the only real Street fighter game since 3s (SF4 isn’t street fighter despite its title). It was a real footsies based game, yeah combos were too long, abc chains and all that whatever. Reason why so many SF2 and SF3 players can’t stand SF4 is cause it isn’t street fighter, has nothing in common with those games other than on the surface. Feels nothing like those games either.

http://fc00.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2014/192/7/6/ancient_aliens_guy_hd_meme_by_pstrooper-d7p5dz1.png

[AsteriskBlue]

It does look painfully slow and the knockdowns seem to last way too long

I see some of the same errors in SFIV being repeated

With SF4 being such a success for dimps and capcom, it is extremely likely that the next couple of sf games will be based on SF4. Since that first gameplay video I’ve been thinking I shouldn’t be surprised if SFV just feels like SF4 with more combo options.

But we can still hope I guess

[lamhazaart]

Looked incredibly slow

Yea there’s an aesthetic shift going on there. If people were wondering where the visual jump to justify the new version number is, it’s in the way the animations are being done. Traditionally for all the 2D SF’s, the animation has been less about character movement and more about a series of striking comic style poses with brief transitions between them. Attacks in SF2 only have a couple of frames, and one of those frames is held far longer than all the rest. With hitpause, all of the attack animations are really more like a singular static image with a lot of impact. Everybody knows what the first active frame of shoto c.HP looks like, or the first frame of a deep Flashkick, or the shape of Chun’s sweep. The visuals weren’t about character movement, but about those frozen stylish static images. Even though it has detailed animation meshes running at 60fps SF4 apes the same style. The artists made sure that SF4 animations startup very quickly, strike a pose during the hitpause, and then recover quickly with a similar pacing to classic Street Fighter. There’s little emphasis on the animated movement between poses because it’s done so fast, which is the big distinction between SF4 and other 3D fighters like Tekken.

SF5 looks like it throws that in the bin. Visually we’re seeing a lot of emphasis being put into the transitional movement from pose to pose and not on the stationary hitpause ‘shape’. Of course you can’t put a lot of emphasis on that animation unless you give the characters time to move and animate, so the attacks have to be slowed down in order to accommodate lengthy animations. Where it starts to look odd is that they’ve attempted to keep semi-quick startup on most of these attacks, so the extra animation work is back-loaded into the attack recovery… Watching the gameplay here you can see that for most of the heavier normals and specials there’s this whacky thing going on where character attacks come out pretty snappy, and then right as the active portion of the attack starts the character suddenly decides he’s not playing Street Fighter any more and it turns into a flowing Virtua Fighter recovery animation. Apparently it takes 5 frames to stick your foot out and 50 frames to pull it back in again.

Look at the Ryu Jumping/Standing Fierce at 5:22. This is a combo. It’s like 2 seconds between these hits. To make longer attack recovery functional it looks like hit and block stun have had to be greatly lengthened to allow time for the elaborate animations. Normally this kind of recovery on normals would be whiff punish central, but the walking speed also seems to be so slow that footsies are also crippled to make the animations work. And yet jump attacks still drop out of the sky like they’re playing ST. In SF5 right now you can probably punish a c.MK by jumping over it.

So to visually separate SF5 from SF4 Capcom have gone for a big jump in animation detail. To allow for that jump in animation detail they’ve had to extend the length of all the animations, primarily in the recovery stage. To allow for that long recovery they’ve had to increase hit and block stun times. I don’t know about you but I’m worried about how art seems to be driving game design here.

I’m not disagreeing with you, but if you’re right and the dev team is after “smoothness”, they’re failing horribly. The animation is risibly slow, and I don’t think it adds to the “smoothness” at all. 3s had glorious and smooth animation. Back when I first saw Makoto, I was sure she’d had her moves modeled painstakingly after a mixture of Shotokan and Kyokushin, and they were convincing. 3s is an order of magnitude quicker than this, and yet it achieves far more smoothness because your brain’s filling in the gaps. I also think it’s possible that the gameplay was slowed down in SFV, and it was therefore necessary to add animation frames to make up for the loss in speed. Whatever the case, it’s ugly as sin, and it doesn’t look fun at all. It’s weird when a fighting game character’s punch is taking as long as it takes a real person to do a kick. It looks like they’re fighting in molasses.

Hopefully the gameplay speed will see some tweaks during later development.

[Citrus_monkey]

I don’t see this ‘‘slow as molasses’’ gameplay everyone seems to be talking about. After looking at SFIV, I feel like the speed is not much different. SFIII is faster than this, that is for sure. Regardless of actual in game data or whatnot, it’s visibly clear. We have to give time to the game and understand it’s intricacies before we say that it’s slow. Do remember that there’s considerably more(recoverable) chip damage and counter hits seems to be the name of the name of the game. The dev team might have purposefully slowed the game down just a tad bit so that the actual game speed functions well in conjunction with these new(or revamped) features.

Regardless, I don’t think it’s as slow as people are making it out to be. Look at the HD gameplay trailers and you’ll see. The taipei screen footage looks slow but it’s more of a quality/illusion thing that is making people think the game will look and play like it did in the video. It won’t. that video is deceptive. I do wish they had tried a more stylized approach, maybe somewhere between the extremely cell-shaded GGxrd and the current realism they’re going for…but I don’t think it looks bad. I’m actually appreciating the gritty battle feeling this game has so far, akin to the KI series. What I mean is that when someone gets hit it looks the part, it looks brutal. Not like in SFIV when the sound effects and animation for getting hit make you feel like you’re hitting an old wooden board.

[Projectjustice]

I just dont understand how anyone can be failing horribly when the game is only 10% of being complete. Speaking as if this is a finished product.

Its like some of you guys never created anything or worked on something that requires time and a process.

This is why Companies dont pay attention to forums. Im glad they dont cause I bet you when the game is complete all this bitching and moaning taking place now would be all for nothing.

[FeistyFree]

I just dont understand how anyone can be failing horribly when the game is only 10% of being complete. Speaking as if this is a finished product.

Its like some of you guys never created anything or worked on something that requires time and a process.

This is why Companies dont pay attention to forums. Im glad they dont cause I bet you when the game is complete all this bitching and moaning taking place now would be all for nothing.

Let me try to explain how I see this:

It was said that the game is already 10-20% finished and we get to see this trailer and those two exhibitions that look (graphically) “overwhelming” with detailed animations and particals everywhere (not so sure about this…)
and, well, people PLAYED the game already. So when people can already play the game, the 80% that may be missing are characters, stages and menus. Gameplay is finished with those 20% that are done and make the game playable.

That is probably the reason why people complain as if the product is already finished.

[Projectjustice]

I just dont understand how anyone can be failing horribly when the game is only 10% of being complete. Speaking as if this is a finished product.

Its like some of you guys never created anything or worked on something that requires time and a process.

This is why Companies dont pay attention to forums. Im glad they dont cause I bet you when the game is complete all this bitching and moaning taking place now would be all for nothing.

Let me try to explain how I see this:

It was said that the game is already 10-20% finished and we get to see this trailer and those two exhibitions that look (graphically) “overwhelming” with detailed animations and particals everywhere (not so sure about this…)
and, well, people PLAYED the game already. So when people can already play the game, the 80% that may be missing are characters, stages and menus. Gameplay is finished with those 20% that are done and make the game playable.

That is probably the reason why people complain as if the product is already finished.

Yet it still make no sense. When we watched Diago vs Gamerbee play they had no idea what they were doing. They didnt even get a chance to practice before the match.
Personally I dont see a problem with the gamespeed. It looks the same as SF4. What I do notice is the game is so much more animation heavy than SF4. Its like its SF3 in 3D. Which can give the illusion of slowness in a 3D environment. Can they speed up the game a bit? Sure they could but we need to find out a lot more about the fighting meta game and sub engines before that can be determined.

So many things can change and will change. Gameplay isnt finished, nothing is finished untill the game is released.

[cazetta]

I doubt the mechanics are fully ready.

[AsteriskBlue]

Yeah but at the same time they ate not showing us footage for no reason. What we’ve seen will probably be pretty close to the final product.

There are some interesting things in the matches they’ve shown us…it’s just theres also some stuff that doesn’t look so good.

[Citrus_monkey]

I just dont understand how anyone can be failing horribly when the game is only 10% of being complete. Speaking as if this is a finished product.

Its like some of you guys never created anything or worked on something that requires time and a process.

This is why Companies dont pay attention to forums. Im glad they dont cause I bet you when the game is complete all this bitching and moaning taking place now would be all for nothing.

Let me try to explain how I see this:

It was said that the game is already 10-20% finished and we get to see this trailer and those two exhibitions that look (graphically) “overwhelming” with detailed animations and particals everywhere (not so sure about this…)
and, well, people PLAYED the game already. So when people can already play the game, the 80% that may be missing are characters, stages and menus. Gameplay is finished with those 20% that are done and make the game playable.

That is probably the reason why people complain as if the product is already finished.

Yet it still make no sense. When we watched Diago vs Gamerbee play they had no idea what they were doing. They didnt even get a chance to practice before the match.
Personally I dont see a problem with the gamespeed. It looks the same as SF4. What I do notice is the game is so much more animation heavy than SF4. Its like its SF3 in 3D. Which can give the illusion of slowness in a 3D environment. Can they speed up the game a bit? Sure they could but we need to find out a lot more about the fighting meta game and sub engines before that can be determined.

So many things can change and will change. Gameplay isnt finished, nothing is finished untill the game is released.

I’ve been trying to make the same points you have, mainly because they seem fairly obvious to understand but there’s this constant influx of negativity regarding the game, regardless of how many people keep stating that we know very little about the game and it’s actual speed at this point. When we see people that know how to PROPERLY play the game we will be able to tell if it is indeed too slow. Way, way too early to decide that now.

[Ki_Shima]

the reason it looks slow is because the hitboxes are smaller and the reaction to hits are more emotive.

the problem is the visual memory (which holds loads of gameplay memories) is conflicted in the viewer so they believe the game is slower than it actually is. third strike is often believed to be a better game than 4 and 5 seems to share the same speed as 3.

think people are gonna have to see more characters for a reliable judge on the gameplay

[Projectjustice]

Yeah but at the same time they ate not showing us footage for no reason. What we’ve seen will probably be** pretty close to the final product**.

There are some interesting things in the matches they’ve shown us…it’s just theres also some stuff that doesn’t look so good.

10% is the official number but to you its pretty close to final? What in the world!? lol

If SFV is pretty much close to final why isnt it going to be released in 2 months? Why do we have to wait till 2016? It cant be the roster since the roster will remain small. It just doesnt add up that the game is over a year away. Just doesnt add up for a game thats pretty much close to final.

[img]http://media.eventhubs.com/images/2011/12/1_alpha06.jpg[img]

Well all know this is what SF4 ended up looking like right? lol

[blufang]

Trailers for future games are meant to hype up the audience. Fighting games are no exception. SFV fails to do so in gameplay or presentation.

[AsteriskBlue]

I don’t think I explained myself well enough. Im saying its likely close because they are showing matches. Creating other characters (a giant portion of the work of a fighting game), stages, modes, recording voices, and then tesing everything is a ton of work, yeah, but they could still decide a ton about how the basic fighting system will work already and just tweak it as the rest of the game fleshes out. This is what I think is happening. Its also what has happened with a few other recent fighting games.

An example of this is tekken 7 after the 1st location test Harada the game was maybe at the halfway mark, yet the release of the game in arcades was scheduled for 6-7 months after that, with out any drastic changes.

[Duaie]

@Projectjustice
These images are irrelevant, that was the prototype version of SF4, not what they revealed to the public. Prototype is a much earlier stage than what’s been shown with SF5, it’s like -20% completion.

If you want a fair comparison, you have to consider the first public version of SF4. Which was also bad, but if you noticed almost all of the animations were definitive and the only things that changed were the faces and the color saturation.

Also, Capcom said it was 20% complete (not 10%). With that, it probably means they still need to work on the netcode, balance, story mode, menus, all the offline and online modes, music, testing, etc. The gameplay we’ve seen is likely not that different than what we’re going to play, sadly.

[cazetta]

You are just assuming things. We just can’t have that sure.

[Darklightjg1]

I’d rather the concerns about speed be voiced now than when it actually is too late to potentially do anything about it or at least showcase adequate footage to put people at ease.