Piggybacking on this, there are exceptions. At certain spacings near the corner, you can do C Crow Bites after a minute spike loop. You can also do it if you anti-aired someone with Ein Trigger into Second Shell. They get knocked high enough so that it hits. You can also do it if you hit someone in the air high enough with a grounded minute spike.
There are all kinds of funky exceptions that can give you the edge if you’re aware of them.
@Sparkster: Maybe it would be better to explain what types of oki you can get off of dp+A. I play him a lot, but even I don’t get how that works considering dp+C is a hard knockdown. Thank you in advance.
Jump CD? Well, you can, in the corner do it after every Ein trigger juggle. If you have enough meter, you could do d.B x2, qcf+A, f+D, j.CD, (in the air) qcb+BD, dp+A (1 hit), [DC] qcf+C, f+D, j.CD => Etc. As long as you have meter and drive, you could keep doing this over and over. Could work pretty well in HD mode.
DP + C gives a hard knockdown, but you barely have any frame advantage. One of the only good options off of that knockdown is to walk backwards and forwards slightly (walking in and out of throw range) and then do a delayed or meaty cr.B or Ein Trigger, and if the opponent is really scared then go for the throw. This is basically the standard oki you get with Ken in 3S, sans parrying being a threat. You’d see plenty of this in old arcade videos, though you can’t keep spinning Eins as easily anymore since it’s not hella plus each time anymore. So the followup choices are fairly stiff.
DP + A gives you a soft knockdown, but there’s a lot you can do off of it based on the longer advantage and whether or not they tech the knockdown. Should they quicktech, you still have enough time to walk back and set up a footsie/delayed cr.B or Ein Trigger or whatever (such as whiffing a st.A in order to bait a counterpoke from then, but then hopping/cr.Bing them out of their poke). One huge difference though is if they tech, you can immediately go for a throw when they stand up. Land that throw, and you get a free safejump into more corner pressure, and even if they tech you’ve got them cornered at ideal Ein Trigger range. The next mixup based off this is that meaty cr.Bs become even more scary off a quicktech since you have to stand up to tech. The opponent may end up just wanting to take the throw and be forced into the hard knockdown to avoid this situation again, but if you can catch them trying to tech then you can hitconfirm whatever corner combo you want. Lastly, you wont always wanna go wild with the throw/low mixup since eventually the opponent will get desperate and try a DP or reversal command grab, but walking back a bit into that ideal corner lockdown range will take you outside throw ranges, and you could always try baiting the DP even when closer.
If they don’t tech, you an move around into whatever spacing you feel is best or even try timing meaty or safe hop, or even feel out a super meaty ein trigger to start out your blockstrings. Basically, do whatever spacial control or blockstring option that you want: walk back, then forward and throw a scared opponent, stagger some cr.Bs, try catching a hop with a delayed st.A or Ein Trigger, and so on.
Thanks, I think that makes a lot more sense now that you’ve put your point in perspective. This is something anyone can apply with K’ since he has to end most of his combos with A Crow Bites anyway.
How the fuck do you get Second Shell to hit more than once in a combo? I am having a little trouble with that. I know the body has to be at a certain height right? I can do crow bites+A, eintrigger+A, second shot loop but I cant get the 2nd second shell in a simple HD to work.
Remember you do not need to do the HCBF motion for the DP into ein in HD, which makes it much easier.
edit; oh yea, it’s worth noting you can HD off an ein trigger > fD follow up by doing HD bypass TK EX minute spike.
you can also hop/jump CD after the fD follow up, land, then bypass. Doing K’s optimal HD you get 961 for 4 bars in the corner. Without a jumpin and a cl C > fA XX A Ein you get 900.
double edit: wait, you’re saying the second shoot is giving you trouble? the fD followup? You’re hitting the C ein and the fD won’t connect? Please elaborate, this is a problem I have never encountered.
Oh I end up getting it lol.
I meant like this combo near the corner(bold is where I had the problem):
2Bx2. A Ein Trigger, Second Shot(upkicks), minute spike > narrow spike, delay, A+Crow Bites, C Ein trigger, Second Shot, 6A, Chain Drive.
That’s where I couldn’t get to work, but like you said they have to be closer to the ground, I can do it now but it’s gonna take some time. It’s some pretty strict timing and it seems to depend on the character as well.
Been working off and on on that chain for a month or two. In HD mode, it’s simple, but really hard outside of it. However, it’s one of K’ most damaging combos. With a j.C, st.C(1hit) starter, it’s 544 dmg for 1 bar, 1 drive. That’s a lot for a near corner combo.
Anywhere normal throw, you can back up and normal jump then do A,B, or C(C or A may give you a crossup :)). Or you can just throw, stand for a couple frames, shorthop A or B(If you hyperhop and your opponent crouches, you can get trip guarded, be careful and make sure to normal hop).
Heat Drive also gives him setups if you don’t do the OTG Minute Spike.
Any Chain Drive DM. However, If I do a normal Chain Drive, I usually A+Blackout. At this point you can either hop in, Ein trigger or poke the opponent. If in the corner, you should recover from A+blackout fast enough to do a 2B and be relatively safe(except from command grabs).
Any reset from Ein trigger followup in the corner. Just reset with a 5A or 2A and hop A/B/C/D.
C Crow bites.
Also, from a normal throw, remember you can use ein triger to frame trap and you can actually do ein trigger> blackout followup for mixup. I use EX Ein as well since frame trap trigger is + frame advantage on guard regardless. Also near the corner, after an ein trigger reset, he can frame trap with 5C and since it is two hit, it is cancelable into ein trigger or blackout. Remember EX Blackout is invincible so never be afraid to throw that out. You can also get a normal throw, delay, ex blackout to come out on the other side(midscreen only or close to corner) and hit them there.
Another thing to remember is that his 2A is + advantage on block, put this with some hop pressure with 8D or CD and a certain distance in the corner, you cannot be punished by DP attempts. Also, use 5B A LOT MORE, it can be HD bypassed, is 4 frames, and +1 on block. Poke them in the corner, force a jump, DP.
Finally, since his 5A hits high only and does not hit crouchers, train the opponent to block your lows, then do something like 2B, 5A, GRAB. Or you can go low again, or backup nuetral hop CD. Lastly, 8D sometimes whiffs crouchers depending on your jump arc. Use this to force a high block and go low
You also get a safe jump setup from Ein Trigger > Second Shoot. If you do d.B x(1~2), qcf+A, f+B and the fireball connects, you can quickly run at them. If they tech, you can hop and do nothing. If they don’t tech, run in and hyper hop j.C. With proper timing, it’s a safe jump.
This is a bit more experimental and gimmicky. They probably won’t fall for this twice. Immediately after you gain control of K’ again from the Ein Trigger > Second Shoot, you can do qcb+B, qcb+B really fast and close the distance or just do one qcf+D. If you do, you can block safely and gain meter as well as close the distance. With the qcf+D one, you have to do it immediately. It’s 4F DP safe so it can be used to bait responses.
This is something Athena can do, or I’ve seen her do, but it’s pretty dirty. On a throw, you can quickly do light version blackout. As they recover, you sweep them. If the sweep connects, you score a little extra damage and you’re pretty far away from DP range and most far range normals will come out for characters so full combos aren’t a problem.
Not only that, you can immediately cancel the sweep into EX Chain Drive for a free super.
I know this is a really common problem that’s already been discussed at length but what is the easiest way to get dp.A xx qcf.C f.D in HD mode? I’ve tried the f, d, df.A, f.C, f.D method to no avail and I have tried the hcb f.A qcf.C a little bit but it’s not working for me either. Everything else about k is coming naturally to me but I get heat drive instead of Ein like all the time despite my best efforts. What do all y’all use? •__•
In HD mode? You just hold forward after doing the dp+A and you get qcf+C once you press C instead.
Outside of HD mode? You have to do a shortcut for dp and then do qcf+C. It’s really a lot harder, but once you get what works for you, it’ll be useful.
Alright, I will just grind it out till I find the timing then. I couldn’t get the hold forward HD method to work but I will keep trying :] any notes on the dp.A f.C methods timing or button presses?
do f, qcf.A~C and hold the forward and C pressed down. If you are not getting it you are probably not going all the way to forward or pressing C too late
So it’s sort of like I hit A when on the df of that qcf, then hit C on the f input like a plink or one of those aB kA bK moves in soul calibur?
Edit: Totally works! My issue was trying to learn this while not in HD mode even though that’s the only time I’d be using it anyway, all I have to do is f, d, df.A, f.C (hold) f.D. works so easy every time ;D
