I don’t think so personally, I think his damage is pretty solid and around mid-table. The target combo he was using was making the H.Shoryuken whiff hits I think, resulting in lower damage. H.Shoryuken whiffs it’s biggest damaging hits pretty easily from what I’ve seen across the web.
Hm could be.
Also h tatsu is probably a better ender, since it should do more damage and gives much better carry and oki.
The first (and most damaging) hit of Ken’s srk definitely whiffs after the kicks target combo, resulting in lesser damage. What i want to know is how negative is his mp hp target combo on block. Another thing i noticed is that Ken seems to recover faster than he used to after throwing a fireball.
As for H tatsu being a better ender, i guess that depends on the way scaling is done in the game. An lk tatsu followed by an ex srk might be preferable in some cases since it also has a lot of carry and it leaves the opponent in a perfect position for a ftk mixup.
It also looks that fireball is mad unsafe on block now for both ryu and ken. I see mediums punishing them a lot on the footage avaiable so far.
Nobody has picked up on it but Momochi lands a jump-in, goes st.mp > run cancel > st.mp/st.hp TC and it combos which I don’t think I’ve seen anywhere else yet, which is very snazzy and should give him some super nice damage output when people figure him out entirely. I’m feeling mk/hk TC > run cancel > mp/hp into h.shoryu would deal quite a big chunk and should work as a punish, also wondering how the cooldown works for the run.
Oh, and Momo didn’t get to show it off but that ex tatsu in the air seems to lead right into good reset territory, it was in the reveal trailer too. I really wanted him to explore what you could do with it but I’ll have to wait until the beta unfortunately :c
He actually cancels a st hp to a cr lp, lp tatsu ex srk combo. Damage wise, he would probably be better off with cr mp to mp/hp TC, lk tatsu ex srk combo.
Oops, my bad. I can see some serious damage coming from his crush counter into stuff like that.
St hp run cancel into b.mp, hp TC. Would be too strong. Hopefully it combos
Went 19-0 with Ken at Evo. Never played a big name though. Kens V-Trigger seems pretty strong, but his V-skill seems to be lacking, probably worst one in the game currently unless there ends ups being some cool tech with it (entirely possible).
- His target combo is unsafe unless cancelled into EX fireball (normal fireball even midscreen is punishable on block by anything at that range as his fireballs have almost no pushback currently).
- His EX divekick is 2 hits so is advantage even if you hit them near the top of their head. Decent mixup between crossup j.MK, j. RH, and this.
- His sweep is just like Ryu’s in terms of being highly punishable.
- His EX-dp is a really solid punisher because of speed and how it lunges forward.
- His Fierce tatsu only combos from fierce attacks, but EX tatsu combo’d from medium kick.
- Shoto crouching MK range is kinda meh in this game, but for Ken you get a hit confirmable 50%+ damage starter with low forward->fireball->V-Trigger cancel
- His v-trigger is actually really solid because his normal fireball becomes like shakunatsu and all his specials get better speed and recovery. LP DP->EX DP is a legit combo when activated.
- b.MP seems to be + on block like it was in 3rd strike.
- cr.MP->b.MP combos from a pretty good range compred to what you would expect and b.MP->b.FP never seemed to whiff even when really far.
- b.FP is a really strong anti-air for that anti-crossup range like in SFII.
- Air tatsu can crossup but only did it once at the right timing where it hit them and didn’t get a combo from it with cr. MK easily could have been my timing.
- Neutral jumping throws can lead to basically a free win if they have more than 5-10% stun and you have v-trigger activation available. 50% damage + stun into new combo is pretty much death.
- cr. MK->Fireball seems to combo now at pretty much all ranges.
- Normal->V-skill cancel is pretty bad to the point of almost being unusable since he can’t cancel into specials like LP dp and seems to only be able to cancel into normals where he will be MAD negative on block. His dash is so fast the difference between v-skill run stop and just dashing is pointless for the added risk his v-skill adds.
- st. RH->Counter hit->V-skill is pretty high damage but you have to hit confirm it as it is negative on block not enough time to figure out how practical hit confirming it was. That and the above momochi combos are the only potential uses I currently see for his v-skill its potential as a pressure tool is pretty gimmicky.
Personally I don’t see him randomly v-trigger cancelling like some characters and using it as a free super given each round as after activating it he is VERY scary and the MASSIVE combo damage you get from a fireball cancel into it is frankly absurd. You can do cr. MK->Fireball->V-trigger->cr.MP->b.MP->b. FP->LP DP->EX DP for over 50%.
I’m extremely hyped for Ken and he’s not in the beta…blah!
Thanks for the info Sephiroth, I’ve added it to my notes on Ken.
How did you feel his overall gameplan was as of beta-phase?
I have a tendency to place Ken in USF4 as a zoner and then punish mistakes with knockdowns and continue pressure until I have to reset my position.
Obviously knockdowns aren’t as a high priority in SFV, so how did you get in mostly?
You just made my day mate! Thanks :).
Honestly wakeup is really quick so was having a hard time consistently doing meaties so I played him like a zoner 90% of my matches, but near the end after I got meaty timing down i was able to get his rush down game working. He’ll be like he was in 3S a mix between rush down, punish, and being able to play a strong footsie game. Shoto cr. MK seems weaker than 4 though so not sure how well shotos will be able to use it against the future cast. His rush down is super solid but I felt his v-trigger fireball cancel was his strongest asset as 1 whiff punish was basically GG if I got any hit afterwards because the stun in this game is ridiculous. V-trigger combo into f. RH was stun. So v-trigger->into 50/50 mixup was basically the end of any round. People were mashing so hard being aggressive when you aren’t used to timings or frame advantage is kinda hard.
My wins basically were because I anti-aired 95% of jump-ins and was able to turn cr. MK->Fireball into 40%+ with day 1 combos and cr.MK->Fireball into 50% once I felt more confident with his cr. MP->b.MP link. Also his punishment game is the best in the game currently because of EX srk and his v-trigger cancel.
Day 1 assumptions say his end game plan will basically be to fish with st. RH CH and whiff punishes like cr. RH->V-skill to get in. Sweeps in this game have ALOT more range than other normals with the entire cast, but all seemed to be punishable by other sweeps. Then you get in and bully with b.MP, cr. lights, and EX divekick. Once you get v-trigger if you have the footsie advantage you’ll just look for a hit confirm into cr. MK->Fireball to set up your big damage into 50/50 stun with f. RH, f. RH but holding it so it cancels into cr. LK or throw. If a character has poor defense you’ll stay in their face and try to do cr. MP->b.MP hit confirms or something else into fireball v-trigger. His divekick gets around fireballs fairly easily, but not sure it is as good as cammy’s for up close stuff since it launches on hit and kinda had a startup to it though it moved plenty quickly once it started moving. Felt more like a move you use to get in from fireballs and mixup anti-air timings so you can get in. With no OS throw tech though wasn’t 100% sure. Didn’t use it a lot because normal crossup/not crossup mixups were working good enough and preferred to save my meter for ex dp’s and critical arts. He can also get in from most whiff punishes with cr. MK->EX hurricane.
Honestly Cammy and him were the strongest 2 characters in my opinion, where his might have been stronger just because his damage was flat out bonkers off a v-trigger cancel and Ken’s v-trigger hit confirms are easier to get. With full meters Ken is basically like Gen from SFIV with a better uppercut and dash.
Don’t forget that fireball is horrendously punishable (medium and some sweeps) on block that last one is a mixed bag unless hit confirming it is possible. I got away with it a lot on day 1 but people are going to murder ken’s on block for it by week 2.
Momochi said you should be cancelling into V-Skill from s.HP.
Aaah im so hype for this game
Why no Ken in the beta though serious?
First beta build has probably been in development for a while. Maybe we’ll see him in second and third beta.
Well, SF5 in general seems geared towards footsies and hit confirms so i don’t really mind that. It’s definitely possible to confirm a special from a crouching medium, SF3 was built around those types of cancels.
one of my main questions is if there is even a combo from DP>V-Trigger that does decent damage. it seems like a mostly useless option in the face of FB>V-Trigger since you can hit a guaranteed normal/target combo before your next attack.
yes, you’ll be able to tack on a little more damage from a successful antiair with it, but it’d be nice if there was a harder but more damaging option from DP. here’s hoping!
If Ken shows up in the beta and that’s an option, it’ll be found in the lab.
I wouldn’t be surprised if something like DP xx V-trigger - EX air tatsu - DP might be possible.