Notes from training mode tonight that are not shigekiyo related:
BRUNO
*Bruno’s wall bounce kick in stand off now can cross up with Aversion, and can be cancelled into dd+teleport instead of doing the kick.
*Bruno’s S/On zipper projectile now spin launches, puttstunn allows combos
*I am not a bruno expert, but i think the move that is now 46+attack used to be HCF+Attack
*I couldn’t really find a use for new Stand Cancel
JOHNNY
*Instant horse from unmounted is actually like the best use of the new stand cancel mechanic I’ve seen thus far. figures it’s with a non stand style lol. this basically let’s johnny, provided he has the meter, to get normals into level 2 from horseless
*johnny can fake DP+attack now by holding the button and pressing C. Uses one nail though.
*The invincibility on the new teleport seems like a huge oversight. You are invincibile the whole time you’re in the hole. It’s like, the ultimate timer scam. lol I love it
EVERYONE THAT USES MODE
I genuinely have no idea how to use any of the new mode changes, except that Cars can now do whatever chain > S > link 5B, but with the meter drain it dosen’t seem worth it…
ROHAN
DP is invincible, FINALLY
He gets to hit OTG with stand off normals, but it’s hard and situational
Honestly he still kind of sucks, but he’s not free once you knock him down anymore, which is great news for him, and any DP hit = OTG Safety Lock.
AKIRA
HOLY SHIT.
Like, every special move has less recovery, it feels like, in stand off. Airplane and red hot’s jump attack are amazing.
DD+S builds tooooonnns of electric gauge quickly
Dude can get overcharged pretty quickly off a knockdown
Period: this guy is a real threat now
Okay, so, those are my notes from the stream. Now someone get to work on translating that ridiculous 26 page pdf file lol
465 for 1.25 bars (from a jump-in) for making up a non-optimized combo from Dio’s new Son 2H > 214L > JC series. Man I love this character. Get fucked, Joestars!
I like the changes to stylish dodge, makes option select JD a little less easy.
Not super excited about further limiting taunt loops though. The threat of being HKD near a puddle is one of my favorite parts of Hol Horse’s game.
Immediately noticed those Akira buffs, it is awesome. Getting overcharged is so easy it’s almost criminal, I kinda feel like picking him up again.
I think it said for Pucci he can block during the Green Baby’s recovery but I don’t know if it’s true. I tried it but still got hit even when holding back.
Lisa Lisa has got some serious buffs in this version. Her flipkick after the M rekka overhead now does like 20% guard damage ON ITS OWN. People are not gonna want to sit around and block this move anymore, so it’s gonna be a great conditioning tool to make people want to mash. Plus if you guard break on the 2nd hit (very likely given the MASSIVE guard damage), you can easily boost the damage of your conversion by doing MM one more time, and then PC’ing and running up into LMH whatever.
I think I finally figured out the weird quirk to her leaping throw knockdown. For whatever reason, it seems if you land the move from the right side of the screen (1P or 2P doesn’t matter, just be on the right), Lisa Lisa will land right next to the opponent afterwards instead of being pushed back.
Snake Muffler also got huge buffs – it recovers so fast now that it’s safe on block! You can now get a full safe jump off it without PCing, and on hit you can “juggle” with 2H afterwards for extra knockdown time, and OTG with another Snake Muffler if for some reason you want a bit more damage. PCing the move is now even more useless, though, because you don’t even need it for safety or reduced recovery on hit anymore.
You can do jump attacks out of her H > H crossover hop now. If you space it right, you not only get a nice instant overhead out of it, but you can also convert it into a full combo with LMH > whatever upon landing.
Knife is ALMOST not useless now, at least the S version – you can do it from vertical jump, and you can now finally combo the L followup from j214S into a full combo on the ground. But it’s not TOO much better because you can no longer cancel jumping normals INTO it – you can only do the knife standalone. So basically only the S version is worth anything now.
Dio Brando:
[details=Spoiler]
Dio Brando’s forward super jump no longer goes super far forward, so it’s a lot easier to punish now.
On the plus side, his super jumps now all fall much faster, particularly his vertical one. So it should be a little harder for people to camp under your ass waiting to anti-air you, as long as you mix up what you do on block.
His meter drain is definitely defanged a bit now that it only drains a 3rd of a bar. 3 combos to suck 1 meter will definitely hurt his momentum unless he gets a bunch of good reads very early on.
He lost pretty much all of his hard knockdowns from his specials. Guess it’s time to start sweeping.
Due to the faster fall on his vertical super jump, he now has a very tight Jonathan-style mini-juggle he can do from his rekka launcher: vertical empty sjc > land > 5L > VERY slow chain 5M > 236X > 236X > HHA, or cancel normals into GHA.
His 6H got a decent buff – it now comes out much faster (no more mashable gap if you chain 5H > 6H) and hits overhead on the 2nd hit. You can now also cancel it into GHA.
They randomly switched the commands for 214L and 214M. M is now the low, L is now the overhead. So be aware.[/details]
Old Joseph:
Spoiler
Old Joseph stand toggle animation is indeed faster. The silly standing loop on young Joseph (Son LMH > 41236A > OTG grab > PC > jH > repeat) still works.
His damage on normals and specials is lower, but his combo format is almost unchanged.
His Soff 41236L/M/H are now soft knockdown – really FAST soft knockdown, to the point where they’re disadvantaged (but safe) on hit. Thankfully I don’t think this game has any 0-to-3-frame supers to shit on you even if you HIT your opponent.
His oil is no longer unblockable and knocks down instead of crumpling. RIP dumb resets.
His anti-air grab is still the same. Snatch to your heart’s content!
DIO:
Spoiler
His 236H feint is useless aside from some very minor combo utility (Soff 2H > 236H > road sign OTG). He doesn’t move and there is no white “super” flash, so it’s incredibly telegraphed. What a letdown. Good thing the rest of the DIO buffs were actually GOOD.
The combo I made up earlier using DIO’s new 2H > 214L > JC series is as follows:
Son jH, LM 2H > 214L > JC > jH > j236X > Stand Rush > jL (while j236x is still hitting) > 5L > 5H > 236L > HHA
And of course the Japanese players have already come up with way better combos than I could make up:
I like the changes made to Cream, you can change the trajectory with additional inputs making it… well, not as shyte. (or maybe a more compotent player can test it better then me, lol).
Noooooooooooooooooooooo! My fraudulent tactics are nothing now!
You can just sort of down back intermittently in blockstrings without much penalty, if there’s a gap in the string you can SD, if not you stay blocking, though now that I’m thinking about it, down back still SDs mids.
The buff to anti air SD is pretty sweet though.
I’m probably missing something, but was there an issue with SDing air attacks before? Don’t you recover instantly once the SD freeze was finished and could punish if they didn’t do their attack deep enough? Now, along with the brief bit of invincibility added when you SD, it almost seems like you could juggle your opponent out of their aerial attack, which sounds a bit too good on paper.
That sounds like standard anti-air risk-reward to me. I don’t see where being able to punish earlier from anti-air SD is a huge deal, especially given how low the anti-air damage in this game generally is (with few exceptions like Old Joseph).
Plus in order to anti-air SD, they have to be descending from their jump (unless you psychic SD’ed an instant overhead or something), so even if you recover in time to anti-air punish, they might be at too low a height for an optimal juggle. Punishing landing recovery is still going to be the major source of anti-air damage in this game. If anything, anti-air SD is going to be way better for that than any “traditional” (Street Fighter-style) anti-air punishes it opens up.
The way I interpreted it was you anti air SD, and because your opponent was airborne you get a chance at their landing recovery with the reduced SD animation.
Hadn’t even considered the idea of attempting an anti air with it otherwise.
Stylish Move now has two versions: standing (performed by pressing 4 when hit by a mid, overhead, or unblockable) and crouching (performed by pressing 1 when hit by a mid, low, or unblockable). Performing the wrong version against an mid or unblockable now drains 40% of your Guard Gauge instead of 30%.
it would have made sense if the second stylish move was just for low hits… this way we can still spam down-back without losing a lot of guard gauge, am i wrong?
It’s punishing people for mashing Stylish Dodge and OSing it. It’s similiar to how Just Defend worked in Rumble Fish 2. If you did it for the wrong attacks, you were docked the meter but didn’t get any of the benefits. So, time to stop being a scrub.
Yeah Stylish Dodge still is kind of a derpy implementation of a Just-Defend mechanic. But it was a good decision on CC2’s part to make it deplete guard gauge, at least, so there actually is SOMETHING like a penalty for an extremely advantageous just-defend that can’t really be safely baited (without PC) even by jabs. It would be WAAAAAY too dumb if it was completely free. I don’t think the 1.04 changes do a whole lot to change SD as a whole.
I do find it kinda disappointing that they allow both back and down-back to SD mids, though. I really think they ought to force you to play the standard which-hit-level game given the reward for a successful SD.
If I see someone mashing it, I’ll do an instant overhead or a command overhead every time or just beat them outright with throws. The OS doesn’t help at this point save for unblockable hits
IOH would be a good option for characters who have a safe one, yeah. (Not Lisa Lisa, cause hers isn’t safe. DIO might work…Jolyne would definitely work.) I dunno about ground overheads, though, they seem much easier to stop down-backing and react to. Could work online where lag would cause some blunders, but offline, I dunno.
Unrelated:
yo damn Mista…he may not have gotten quite the rags-to-bitches promotion Akira got, but this is some good stuff
EDIT: found another Mista video
EDIT 2: updated with the correct video
The main threat to mashing Stylish Dodge is they get beat for free by throws. Before that wasn’t an issue, but now that throws to solid damage, it’s a threat. That doesn’t include characters that actually get stuff off throws too, like Oldseph for example. I do agree though, would have been better if Mids were only covered by one of the heights, not both. Either way, it’s even easier to guard crush now, especially if you mash Stylish
