That’s the way to play him. The loop is dandy, but it’s rarely going to be the deciding factor.
There are some pretty serious caveats about crouching heavy punch. It’s 5 active frames, but the last 3 will whiff anyone pressing a crouching button as they wake up because the hitbox is an anti-air hitbox that whiffs crouchers. This means that you can’t actually use those final frames for any character that likes to wake up with crouching jab, so Chun, Mika, Karin, and Cammy at least.
For testing, keep in mind that characters stand on the very first frame after waking up, but any crouching button will cancel that.
The other issue is that it’s -3 on block and has no pushback, so it’s a little dangerous to use in eyeball set-ups, though obviously a lot safer than using standing heavy punch.
If you want to play him at higher levels I would say it is kinda essential to at least have this in your arsenal so you can put the fear of it into your opponent. I’ve seen Chris G and Doyanbo clutch out so many wins from doing it already and we’re only in month three or four of Guile. From my own personal experience I’ll get the chance to hit it roughly once or twice every ten or so matches.
For the record, both Chris G and Dieminion dropped the hit confirm into the loop and both ended up losing those matches at Evo. To me at least that really isn’t what Guile should be about but I understand if anyone disagrees with me. I’m just worried that as long as he has the loop that some of his more glaring issues wont get sorted out.
Dieminion was interviewed at EVO and he said that he felt like he mainly lost because his guile isn’t “tournament ready” and he dropped important combos, and he called the character very execution heavy.
He also said that he changed his mind and thinks Guile is now “really strong” after he stopped thinking about him like it was SF4. It sounds like he may be switching back to Guile from Fang?
The interview: https://esports.yahoo.com/di3mini0n-approach-guile-combos-f-180254248.html
Yup. Echoes exactly what I’ve been saying about him. I think he’s just below that tier of characters we all assume are the top - Ryu, Chun, Nash, Ken, Mika, Karin, Cammy, Necalli. Probably the same level as Vega.
My thoughts on balance changes for Guile:
[list]
[] Flash kick: MK version damage from 120 to 130, HK version from 120 to 140, EX version from 9060 to 9070. FK should deal more damage since it lost invincibility and is CC punishable regardless.
[] Reverse Spin Kick: on hit +4 from +3 (+6 on CH so it combos into cr.MP).
[] Stand HP: on block 0 from -4. That alone would make Guile a lot better. But I don’t think that would too strong because he has poor throw range and no 3 frame normal. You could just mash jab and beat or trade whatever he does afterwards. st.MP would still be his go to meaty.
[] Crouch MP: on block +2 from +1, on hit +4 from +3 (+6 on CH so it combos into itself). It kinda sucks being 6 frame start up, it deserves to be comboable into itself on CH.
[*] V-trigger Sonic Boom: on block +3 from +1.
[/list]
Let me know what you guys think, I focused on improving his offense and damage output because Capcom clearly doesn’t want zoning back.
I honestly think it’s too early to talk about adjustments. Also, all of those sound like SF4 Guile adjustments.
There’s no doubt Guile is difficult to use in this version, but we’re still exploring his options and potential.
That’s a bad list IMO because it ignores how strong pressure is in SFV. Upside down kick is already good, and what you propose kind of gives Guile a pure 50/50 throw mix-up that doesn’t make sense for the character.
+3 on block booms are super good too, you could really bully people with that, especially in the corner, especially characters without a reversal.
I wonder the about the mindset change that he’s talking about. I kinda wish he can elaborate more on that, like the kind of adjustments he made to better sync with SF5 Guile.
I agree with this one.
Nope. -2 would be more reasonable.
I think a better fix would be to make cr.lp > cr.mp into a target combo (unsafe on block unless it’s cancelled into a boom) so Guile had some better bnb’s.
I think you would have to get rid of the ability to do the corner loop otherwise that would be ridiculously strong.
Personally I’d like to see a hitbox buff for UDK if anything. A lot of slides and even low normals can go right under it and not get smacked. My idea is have a second hitbox that appears down lower some frames after the initial higher up hitbox. This way if you end up smacking a low normal with a read it’s effectively hitting meaty and you can combo, but if you aren’t hitting a low normal the first initial hitbox will hit and the frame data is the same as it is now.
The move isn’t meant to smack crouch teching anymore, but since it’s not a close normal anymore either, it’s not unreasonable to counter poke lows with it. You’d rarely be in range for a follow up in that scenario anyways.
I don’t mind st.HP being -2, just not being unsafe is good enough. This crouch target is kinda redundant because he can already link cr.mp from cr.lp on CH, I land it very often.
My idea of improving the V-trigger boom was to make the corner loops easier to get. But yeah, seems excessive along with the other changes.
Pressure is good in SFV in general, but Guile is kinda underwhelming and not properly rewarded to engage in SFV (even though he is supposed to do that in this game). UDK is good as a mid range poke, up close is a not so rewarding commitment (it’s slow, negative on block, and only combos in CH). As I said, st.HP wouldn’t lead to 50/50 unless it were positive on block, but -2 might have been a better compromise. You are probably right about VT booms though.
Yes. I bought the Hori fighting commander and I don’t like it. If you are struggling with anything execution wise with Guile on pad lemme know and I’ll tell you how I’m doing it.
I used the Sega Saturn USB pad on PS3 and wished there was direct input support for PS4. Anyone know if the Brooks USB converter can get the Saturn pad to work on PS4?
No idea. The Brooks people post on this forum though, so you could ask them.
This is proof that you cannot condition your opponent for shit in this game. I literally take 30% of his life, then he does exactly the same thing again. Unbelievable -
why are you trying to condition a bronze player in the first place
I can show you the same type of stuff with gold ranked players.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MklBINMfFbE
Not that you should be judging players ranks. Alex Myers is a rookie. L.I Joe is ultra bronze.
So apparently this works for Guile also but I haven’t tested it yet. If it does then this has the potential to change some of his matches quite drastically. Definitely works for both Vega and Juri.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2wmoyDOElA
Also, this is pretty funny -
Health: 950 -> 1000
St.hp on block: -4 -> -2
V-Trigger: 3 bars - > 2 bars with a proportionally shortened duration.
That’s it, Guile would be pretty good.