"Gettin' that Bike $!" AE Balrog Match-up Thread

^^ damn good post.

I love reading those things that just add little bits to my game. like punishing Bison slide FADC with ultra.
Thinking about it now theres probably a lot of things that are punishable after FADC but I always just think of them as safe because that’s the point of them doing it.

and the sweep on Dhalsim start of round will be interesting, keen to give that a shot.

…i’ve got a list of things that are punishable on FADC backdash by Balrog. It’s in the big spreadsheet on the OPs. hosted on dropbox. It’s on the FADC punishes page. (…there’s like six sheets in the worksheet)

Edit: Also I read your post Jonas, fucking awesome. Soon (hopefully) i’ll get an opportunity to sit down and update the OPs with a lot of the information i’ve gathered over the last couple of months.

Double edit: http://db.tt/NziEMUSN

[media=youtube]86Y4PneNxPg[/media]

Dude, I know this is an old vid, but I have a big question. Near the end of game 1 after u did the HB into ultra, he kept jumping and you kept HB-ing him. Weren’t you afraid of his U2? How come he didn’t use it? I generally go for cr/st HP in those situations.

tldr: Only one unsafe headbutt (the last one), air 720 not buffered from the ground is difficult IMO, so if he’s already off the ground, it’s harder for him to pull out a 720.

Well, I only hb’d once where it was unsafe. The first time he pressed j.hp and he did it really early, so that was generally free. The second time was silly, if you look at the inputs he botched his air 720. Some gief’s would have you believe that it’s an easy input, but it’s not. Very easy off the ground since you can buffer in the first 360 during the jump, but to do it mid-jump, like to confirm the 720 is really difficult IMO. So generally if you don’t jump the gun and do headbutt right as he’s leaving the ground, i’ll say 4 out of 5 times Gief is fodder for headbutt or AA. Mid-screen he’s got more options against headbutt and can space you out, but in the corner, not so much.

Edit: Look at his inputs, notice that he missed the late 720 in the air, no button presses only meat-spinning.

I recently heard that, in Vanilla, if Sim does a yoga fire and Rog jump HK over it, you end up hitting the back of Sim’s head, thus crossing him up!

Anyone heard of this before, and does it still work in 2012 (I think it shld)?

Never heard of it before, does it cross-up entirely (e.g. rog lands behind) or does it just hit behind then he lands in front?

I read this again and forgot to comment about the st/cr.hp. IMO the only time headbutt should really be used against gief is when he’s deep in the corner, so he can’t space you out and do weird things. cr/st.hp are dangerous mid-screen since he can empty jump, but headbutt is a guaranteed AA in the corner 100% of the time except in the case of reaction U2 but otherwise.

Point #1: Rog landed behind Sim. I was pretty stunned by this turn of events myself.

Thanks also for the extra knowledge, regarding point #2. I can fully agree with you on the empty jump thing. Still eating that con-job empty jump into SPD till today :stuck_out_tongue:

Was looking through youtube and I found this. Gives some alternate uses for the focus-tech. Still doesn’t help against akuma :[ , but Ken and Cammy, i think this can definitely cure a few headaches.

[media=youtube]thT3pYVMhCk[/media]

^ looks like a good technique, i will definitely try it out

Can you guys give me tips for the cody match up? everyone says rog beats him but I always lose to cody players :frowning:

Rog doesn’t beat cody, i’d say it’s 6-4 in Cody’s favor. In super, i’d say Rog had that match won, Cody’s walk speed was slower and he didn’t have anything faster than 4f.

In AE, he got a bit faster walk sped, and he got a 3f short. That was enough to change the matchup in his favor. So in general what this means is that Cody can close the distance faster and a bit safer (so balrog can’t really just keep him out with pokes) and he has an awesome crouch tech AND punish for lp.ds I think those two things make the matchup really hard for rog up close.

So it depends on what kind of cody you play. I know of two styles that are pretty much at opposite ends of the spectrum.

You have Cody #1:
I describe this Cody as one who hold’s zonk knuckle hostage. Always charging, always ready, he’ll pick U1, save all of his meter and be content with throwing rocks to bait a dash punch so he can ex.zonk knuckle. IMO, this is an OK strategy, VERY low level, but OK. With this Cody’s you get to play with his wakeup. I feel that cody’s most useless button is jab, all of his other buttons are much more useful, so if a Cody player is using zonk knuckle A LOT, it probably means that he’s charging with jab and thus can’t tech throws…throw him to death. With Zonk knuckle, only ex is invincible to throws, and non-ex only has upper body invincibility. So you get to meaty throw/meaty jab O/S sweep all day. Cody has a single answer to this and that’s ex.cu. If you have a smart Cody, you can’t bait out this option and punish with cr.mp xx whatever OR if he attempts to FADC dash forward, go for the focus-tech. He has armor breaking options, but only zonk knuckle is invincible, and if you block it he gets punish with cr.mp into anything. In general blocked zonk knuckle and block criminal upper equals free cr.mp xx anything, just be aware that you can’t safely cancel into lp.ds on block since he can punish it. (Rule of thumb is to always see if the Cody can consistently punish dash straight on block, as it makes the match that much easier)

Cody #2:
This is a high level Cody. This Cody is looking for you to make mistakes and wants to bait out any type of dash punch. He will usually save his meter for three bar combos into ex.cu for added stun, he’ll use ex.rocks more. Zonk knuckle is used a whole lot less. This cody will also bombard you with frame-traps given the opportunity. So all of Cody’s buttons have pushback, so eventually when you’re blocking a frame-trap, there will be a point where he needs to re-establish spacing so his buttons connect. Most Cody’s will use f+mp, the gut punch that moves him forward, to do this. This move is safe on block, but has a lot of recovery and he can’t cancel it into anything, so if you can re-act to it, focus or ex.dash punch through it for free. And once you can do this you can get in a range where you buttons make sense and/or he has to work to get back into to start frame trapping you again.

AFAIK, that’s the spectrum from mid-level scrubby to high-level tactical. OH and don’t forget, meaty ex.rocks is SAFE. You’ll feel like Super/U1 can catch him, but it’s a lie. Also he can punish your FADC backdash with st.mp after his jump-ins, an easy way to lose a lot of life. Watch out for his b+mp, one of the best AA’s in the game. Look out for cross-up j.hk, it’s pretty sick mid-screen and in the corner. His j.lp can do some weird stuff with ex.dashes on wakeup, and the knife has stupid range, it makes his jab almost as gdlk as his cr.lk.

Since pressing 4 buttons might be hard, does anyone know if you can alternatively press the 3x kick and 3x punch button if taunt is disabled?

If nobody knows I guess I can go home and test it out tonight

yes, thats how daigo does it.

This is a conversation I had with EmanuelB, who was doing some research for the Tier list thread, he has some questions about certain matchups and I felt that there may have been some current information that I gave him that I haven’t had the chance (or been asked here). So I wanted to post the convo verbatim, and you guys could give me your opinion or tell me something I didn’t know or that i’m totally wrong about a certain matchup.

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I can give you blanka vs balrog easy. Blanka down back has no shot vs balrog down back. It’s easy to AA blanka in an offline situation when you have control of your spacing.

Blanka’s hop is very minus and most people don’t react well enough. This is a really bad matchup lol. Yeah you can unblockable but that means you have to throw him. I honestly believe that people play too much online vs blanka and get an impression that it’s not great. This is a terrible matchup for blanka.

I can field any discussion about this matchup. I do main both.

Okay. A lot of my exp is versus offline blanka, and it may simply boil down to me not reacting fast enough to Blanka’s j.hk with Balrog’s cr.hp, but Blanka’s low jump arc aside. What should Balrog be doing in the neutral game, I feel that If I try to bait buttons with pokes, I get counter poked hard with amazon slide or j.hk if I try to poke with a heavy button. What should Balrog be doing to control the spacing. It feels like Blanka can poke really well with his cr.hk and I can’t do enough about it etc. From Balrog’s point of view what do you think his gameplan should be, what is he trying to get Blanka to do and not do?

I feel you should be in Blanka’s face with jab.

your c.HK is better then his plain and simple. Also just blocking and doing nothing is completely fine. Buffer c.MP to dash punch once in a while. He has no way of effectively taking your life away if you down back. On the other hand you can chip him without worry. Slowly move him into the corner and once he’s there he has zero options. If you are trying to heavy attack too often then you will eat a j.HK. So just don’t. If he hops at you just c.LP. Outside of that just block everything and pick and choose your options. Balrog players lose this matchup because they try to rush in too quickly and then it becomes easier for blanka to do things. If you are being more patient and still losing then you’re getting outfootsed.

okay, i’ll try to apply this.

These are more Blanka specific questions that i’m not 100% sure about, but i’ve seen and/or heard about them:
[LIST]
[]When blanka ex.ball’s into the corner or does U1/Super in to the corner, does he recover instantly on touching the wall in general, or is there a specific way it has to be done so that he recovers quickly.
[
]Cross-up hori ball, I’ve seen this alot, esp ex, do you know a specific setup off the top of your head?
[]Is the range where Blanka ball can be safe on block really big or small? I know that if he does blanka ball from the neutral match stance, he lands right in front of you, is just inside that the only time it’ll be safe or am I just talking out of my ass and hori ball can never be made safe against lp.ds?
[
]What’s the specific setup for the unblockable? I remember it being something like forward throw, hop, j.mk or something to that effect
[/LIST]
These have little to do with the match, but more for me, so I understand something and don’t get scrubbed out because i didn’t “know”.

btw, I got some vids for you guys in the vid thread,

Please check them out and critique.