"Gettin' that Bike $!" AE Balrog Match-up Thread

With all these options for TAP, I strongly feel like I’m not using Balrog properly just yet. Akumas often get away with free teleports against me because I try to anticipate them with walkback > cr.HK but I often misjudge the distance.

Also, I’m having major trouble against Chun and Akuma. I somewhat know the Chun matchup (playing footsies id a lost cause, play patient, go hard when inside, etc.)but I’m still having trouble beating my friend. Her strings seem awfully safe and Light Attacks > Overhead kick seems unpunishable meterless. N.jHP between the normal and overhead doesn’t hit fast enough. I can only ever punish it with ex.HB. I got the safejump setups fine (her reversal is easy to beat) but I lack all sorts of OS to beat her backdash on wakeup. Got any tips?

As for Akuma, he seems hard to play footsies against (st.HK is a bitch.) And I haven’t found an answer to most of his zoning. Maybe I’m not aggrressive enough, as I’m a very passive player, but this matchup seems impossible. It’s like ny wins depend on how bad they fuck up.

Against a good Chun and Akuma, I just give up with Balrog and go straight for Bison. Chun’s normals are just so good, when used and spaced correctly, that there is only so much Balrog can do. If Akuma can vortex properly, it’s pretty hard to escape without some pretty good reads. If I were you, I’d just counter-pick.

As I said earlier, i agree with you when i feel that if Balrog beats Akuma it’s because either A) he was a better player or B) the Akuma made a lot of mistakes. Generally if you’re going to play Akuma with Balrog, you should know what a bad Akuma looks like, and what an unsafe fireball/string looks like. Akuma CANNOT play footsies against Balrog like Balrog, not really. His ground fireball is bad and air fireballs are better but have to be thrown correctly. You can snipe a bad fireball at 3/4 screen with lk.smash. Also if you play an Akuma who tries that empty jump low, empty jump throw mixup, U2 is your best friend. Blows that up, very useful against Sakura’s too who try that tactic.Akuma doesn’t have the life to make too many mistakes, so as Balrog i think your goal should be to punish him as hard as possible for not knowing how to play their character.

Against Chun, i think you should spend the first match trying to rush her down, Gief style (e.g. take damage to get in). So if you get in, you can apply pressure up close. I feel that although Chun’s normals are as good as Balrog’s, she needs space to use them efficiently or a kikouken, so once you close the space and get within jab distance, the only normal I feel she can really use is cr.lk. Also if she’s mixing you up with normals canceled into her overhead, you can use your focus attack, in that situation she’s in range, so you can FA and release during her recovery for a full punish, no need to try headbutt which may get stuffed if it’s non-ex.

But in general, i feel that if you can force chun to burn meter, or make her feel as if ex.sbk is an option, you can force her to open herself up by throwing her on her wakeup; the outcome being that she burns meter attempting to reversal with ex.sbk OR she decides to not attempt ex.sbk and block so she gets thrown or frame trapped. Obviously if you block an ex.sbk you can punish with cr.mp into anything and setup your O/S, safe jump oki to start the process over again. If it’s not obvious, if Chun burns meter she doesn’t get access to super, or if you’re pressuring her she doesn’t get an opportunity to build meter for super.

As far an an O/S for backdash, if the regular ones don’t work she may have a funny backdash like fuerte/cammy/ibuki, maybe st.hp might do it, no where near as nice, but the damage is comparable to cr.hk.

Also on a sidenote…I played a Dan and found that his lk.dan kicks can go over lk.smash in the event you’re trying to keep him from mixing you up with focus attack, he can lk.dan kick over your smash and throw/punish you.

okay, I confirmed this on Chun: meaty jab O/S sweep doesn’t work on Chun mid-screen because of her backdash. You can Safe jump O/S sweep which will fufill the same purpose and be pretty safe. She can lk/hk.super to beat your safe jump, unless you jump a bit early. Although she can do it, it’s unlikely that they’ll try it because if you were to miss the safe jump then the super will trade with j.hp or j.hk. It seems to always trade if you do the safe jump from bwd.throw. If you do the safe jump from cr.hk it’ll only trade with her mk.super.

Hey guys, I got vids of both of my losses at the 25th anniversary tournament, anybody want to give me any tips on these matchups?

VS. Adon: [media=youtube]EdR7cuSBs4w[/media]

VS. Ibuki: [media=youtube]Qllt2Ra-ab8[/media]

I got advice for the Ibuki MU. I learned fighting this bitch you really can’t stay in one place holding Down back for to long because she has that command dash, and on top of that a fast forward dash so that’s just asking to be blown up with a focus-cancel-dash into throw or crossed up with the command dash. I find St.mk is my go to normal in this match-up after a dash punch or as a counter poke because it stops the slide and slows down her momentum because the player is 9/10 pressing something. for anti air i love the st mp, its fast and it allows you to not always be in d-back positions so you can move around and still hit them out the air.Its also good after her D-kick because you can hit her in the air if she use that air kunai as a follow up.

Oh in the adon match up when you see him go for the wall dive that’s a free N. jump hp

But in both the match ups you use alot of dash punches, i really recommend that you use normals more. You also stay in D-back which i would try to break the habit of doing. You also jump in without the opp. not being Ukd and i didnt see any throw set ups, thats a big part of rogs game. I loved the st. lp dash punch punish and i believe thats really when you should only use DPunch because of how a focus can blow it up if he predicts your about to use it.

I not the best but I’m on my way understanding every match up and what buttons to use
FYI cr lp, st mk, special, does like 205 -222 damage so that can be used to punish whiffed moved

this is essentially it

i play a really good vega all the time(jozhear) and it’s an effort in frustration to outfootsie vega. your main way of knocking him down is sweeping him, as most vegas will use his great walk speed to try and out footsie you. but sweep is punishable by a 250 damage combo, so your reads need to be on point or else youre gonna get hurt really bad

c.mp is a pretty good poke(but trades/gets beaten by vega c.mp, c.mk and s.mk), c.mk is also under rated but yeah you really need to make that initial read to get the knockdown and then try to exploit his bad wakeup as much as possible. you cant really keep vega cornered so good luck

its not an impossible match by any stretch because you can lay the beatdown on him and his only reversal suck (and the chance to stun is very real) but he does beat you free mid range so you need to be super careful

Reposting from thread: Need help fighting dhalsim

And for my two cents, I think your biggest two problems were blocking and patience. True Dhalsim can walk all over you once you start blocking, but you weren’t really successful in doing it. The Dhalsim wasn’t really throwing either or even going for his OH when up close, you probably could have left/right crouch block all of his mixups. Every teleport he does is going to be a tk.teleport so he’s ALWAYS going to be in the air after he teleports, block high. Check out these two videos, one of my playing a Dhalsim, and the others about blocking some of his mixups, beating them, and punishing some of his attacks.

[media=youtube]yDk1manCe8Q[/media]
[media=youtube]s7GsMTOSKT4[/media]
[media=youtube]H5t7tuHCSEY[/media]

Seems I wiped all my Dhalsim vids from AE and Vanilla - Infact I’ve nuked quite a lot of SF4 vids seeing as people just downvote them anyways - Only one I have on Sim is one of my funny/fun moment vids but I suppose it’ll go towards the point of “If you’re gonna jump, space it”

[media=youtube]TBurYYrlp1A[/media]

Not sure if my opponent was simply rushing or maybe had a little inexperience with Balrog but normally he knows the Ultra has to be done against a much closer jump for it to AA me for the full damage. If you’re too far when you jump, and Dhalsim Ultras, you can store charge freely during the animation freeze and simply Headbutt, Super or Ultra right through it seeing as it’s so slow. If you have a Super or Ultra stocked then don’t headbutt first, it’s a waste. Raw Ultra stole the round whereas a Headbutt/Ultra would probably have kept him alive.

I think it’salso the distance that is also required for JFP to actually trade, or stuff, Dhalsim’s AA Knee - Could be wrong, though.

Sorry to switch gears a bit, please continue with Dhalsim discussion after(I have a money match vs dhalsim in January) but:

Blanka Ultra 2? what are balrog’s options for punishing it if I’m at say half screen and he’s trying to chip me?
or full screen, can I completely avoid chip?

3nig, do you have any advice for me? I would appreciate it

Haters are gonna hate. Just ignore them. If you enjoy doing it, just keep doing it. It’s not like you make a living off of views and votes? Or am I wrong?

these dhalsim videos are really usefull

Hey 3nig, Why haven’t you utilize the use of standing normals to kinda encourage a standing game in any of these MU.
normals like St.mp and st mk, two underused GODLike normals.
St.mp is a game changer in the Akuma,Seth,Ken,Sakura, shit anybody that needs to get in by jumping to start anything and st mk to keep them at bay mixed in with st Hp and Hp

The best example on how to fight Dhalsim

[media=youtube]2X3u0CojuVg[/media]

Blanka U2 Gets Dash Ultra 1 All day Buddy, Or Wait Til after the groud pound then U1. It doesn’t do that much chip

To the best of my knowledge, Balrog does not have an answer to full screen U2. It’s like Seth’s U2 in Super. AFAIK, it’s full screen chip. FuckitExHeadbutt suggests Dash U1. I don’t think that’s an option, but as I haven’t tried it, he may know something I don’t.

I think a standing/walking forward game is good. The only character which I feel standing game is strong is against Sakura. She has to eat standing jab. Seth and Akuma, I just have trouble with them all around, so in my case, I don’t feel that a stronger standing game fixes Balrog’s weakness in that match and that’s what happens after he gets knocked down. If I can not get knocked down the match, it’s easily 6-4, 7-4, but when I get knocked down, standing game doesn’t do anything to fix that. I haven’t played a good Ken in a while, so i’ve got few comments about standing game in that match aside from that he has to play Balrog-esque footsies, and Balrog’s are better.

I’ve got lunch in about 30, i’ll check them out.

Vs Adon:

Tournament Jitters aside, you were wearing your gameplan on your forehead and I think that’s what hurt you the most. More patience, and in some cases more down+back. He jumped a lot partly because you were not anti-airing.

The second round was pretty good, but you were still letting the Adon know what you were afraid of. The first round he did the wall dive, cr.hp beats it every time, no matter the strength once you get the timing down. cr.hp is also safe if he does the short wall dive. When adon starts his pressure, you have to force him to stop. So when he jumps in the air, your only two grounded offensive options are cr.hp/cl.mp and focus attack. IF he does the jaguar kicks in the air, you can Focus attack them for a crumple or AA with cr.hp, headbutt will almost always whiff if he does it in your face. Adon is a character you can force to play footsies with you. This adon didn’t use a lot of st.hk which is why you were able to do some many naked ex.dashes.

The pre-emptive j.hps in the second round let him know that you were afraid of him doing wall dive and didn’t really know how to punish it. If he whiffs an air jaguar kick, whiff punish with sweep, he has some extra recovery I believe (or you can just trip guard him which requires stricter timing). Also the Adon had no idea how to AA with his mk rising jaguar; this should have been your clue to jump at him with shorts, jabs and fierces, then go for tick throws, and/or bait out a rising jaguar. And also, there was not enough AA headbutt. I think like your cr.hp, you didn’t have enough trust in it. A player in Houston Kensou, told me to just do it, fuck it if it trades, just press it every time as soon as it’ll hit.

Vs. Ibuki

Jesus he was pressing a lot of buttons. He was probably buffering in the slide with the standing strong. In that case you could have done three things: hp.hb, whiff punish with st.hk, or walk-forward block, to trigger the buffered attack and punish her slide with cr.mp xx hp.hb or mk.ru into tick throw. I’ll accept ignorance on the jump kicks into super. His Ibuki had no footsies and no ground game, his vortex was poor too, if you could block it every time, either he was bad, or you’re fucking gdlk (i’l l accept either :]) He didn’t know how to open you up, so it (OH to super) was a last resort (like our TAP to ex.hb, or dictators jump to late j.mp, j.mp). You can see that the ibuki’s not confirming the super in the 2nd match. It’s an easy situation to punish with headbutt, it’ll most likely trade, but I don’t think super is punishable on block mid-screen. Also somewhere in the rekka kicks there’s a gap you can punish with headbutt (i don’t remember where though).

He got OH into super too many times. I think you could have won the match if you played a really strong ground game and didn’t approach her, esp if you had the life lead. He was spamming standing strong into slide because he didn’t want you to get in, so just walk in, just out of range of it and sit there, your buttons at that range are better than hers, and she she can’t jump because of cr.hp/headbutt, nor can she get in because of jab. So you can control that match on the ground. Count the counterhits and ask your self what you were trying to accomplish by pressing that button in range of her st.hk. Look at the frame data and see what’s safe on block/hit and then ask yourself again, why was I pressing buttons. You can play that match on the ground really passive, you don’t really need to be in her face, actually being within whiff punish range is really good for that match (IMO), esp if you have down-charge.

With the seth MU i feel that you have to stand the whole match so he wont get a lucky OH that leads into a knock down.

Seths game is to try to get in so he can get his gay ass pressure going,so i walk back and forth looking for those wall jumps,and dive kick because if you notice every seth even Poongko gets in by wall jump,dive kick,and if their feeling themselves just a straight up cross up. That standing Mp hits wall dives clean, trades sometimes with dive kick and hits the crossup. Now what is he going to do if you don’t open yourself up with a dash punch… throw sonic booms, Focus cancel back(if theres no U1), and if he wall jumps hit him with that Standing mp. that standing Mp and playing a solid game shuts seth down.So now he has to get reckless to get his damage playing into your hands. Seth is 5-5 to me. Also a fun fact seth is unsafe when he hits you with extended limbs mid-far part of the screen feel free to use a dash punch then. Seth is your bitch in the MU if you follow these step, and don’t stray from it

Key points
1: Stand the fuck up and move around,you dont wanna be sitting in one place because now he can space and throw safe pressure and you wont get a random dash up command grab.
2: watch out for jump ins, and punish with that standing mp and play footies with St Mk,Hp(not to often) and CrHk.
3: Now that seth is all nice and trained and is getting reckless sit back and use all of Rogs tools.
4: something to remember seth will probably command grab you most of the time if all you do is block so take a chance sometimes and jump when hes close you might get big damage off that whiffed CG.
5: Dont Jump or dash punch, i feel if you actually hit seth with a dash pucnh then he probably a scrub playing a S teir Char. to make him feel better about himself because seth can mash a dp of that turn around kick.
6: We don’t get that bike money unless we win so play smart , Be water my friends becuase that Motherfucker seth is on fire.

A random U2 you can jump in between the Ground pounds then when he’s having his mental breakdown wake his ass up with that U1