66

In my opinion, Bison’s life force and power is connected to the Psycho Power, which is supplied from a matrix generator. When Akuma used the Shungokusatsu on Bison, the power overloaded and caused the probe to break, causing Akuma to vanish. As for Orochi, I think he has godlike ki and is merely a being who has been given demonic ki, being an entity of some sort. In Street Fighter, there can be ki of all kinds. The Hadou is one ki, having immense proportions. However, it reflects who you are. Akuma is evil, having evil ki. Ryu is good, having good ki. Bison uses the Psycho Power, which is less powerful than the Dark Hadou.

67

snaps out of headache mode for a few seconds

Slightly off the Main topic, and of total neutrality

Gouki doesn’t have evil Ki. He just utilises Satsui No hadou, a ‘Source’ of power that he taps that Ryu doesn’t choose to tap from. Stasui no Hadou is not an Evil source as well.

back to the headache

68

Hey, it’s Kyo. (Isn’t it…?)

It seems as if only the agony of woefully fanboyish conjecutre could bring you back. Ironic that it’s mostly about Kyo too…

I agree, though I have to admit, before the ether bullshit and aside from the K9999 delusion; characters being created exactly the same as someone and character being heavily inspired by that someone are TWO DIFFERENT things; Kay-four-nine is NOT Tetsuo, just a heavily inspired homage to him in appearance, mannerisms (after Tetsuo gains his powers), some of his attacks (such as his QCF+P “dust” attack, “The Power is Losing Control”), and some of personality (so he hates everything except for “working on bikes”?).

However, since Pin pretty much destroyed Susano-o’s posts from before the ether crap, I don’t have to respond to that…

Instead…

You’re correct until the comma in the first sentence, then it all just goes downhill. Not because your opinion (for the most part) is shitty; merely because there’s a lot of stuff, much of in TiamatRoar’s guide and probably most it in that huge ass Capcom thread, that contradicts it. So, let’s work out the flaws one sentence at a time.

Beyond the obvious part of first sentence (that Bison’s life force and power are connected to Psycho Power; the former is obvious given what happens to Bison in the majority of the endings [his fucking explodes] and the latter is even more obvious since Psycho Power IS his power), the “matrix generator” that is the Psycho Drive did NOT supply his energy; the Psycho Drive regulated it. If Psycho Drive did not regulate it, then as said and implied in much of SFA3/SFZ3, Bison would have exploded a lot earlier (before even SFA3 came around and maybe even SFA2). So, it couldn’t supply energy since that would be rather counterinitiutive…at least if you meant extra energy; the Psycho Drive can “supply” energy in that aforementioned instance of regulation and also in the in-game instance of focusing his energy into that “bad ending” death beam.

The second sentence is part mixed-up dates and part “WTF”. I’ll explain the “wtf” by saying that I have NO idea what you mean by “probe” or “vanish” (especially since Gouki tends to be enigmatic anyway). As for Gouki killing Bison with the Shungokusatsu, well…that happened in SF2, so Gouki has nothing to do with destroying the Psycho Drive, even in Gouki’s ending where he DOES Shungokusatsu (which just causes us to see Bison explode in his generic death scene for the umpteenth time).

The third and fourth sentences have to be further explained before I can say anything (positive or negative) about them.

As for your fifth sentence, I’d be rather iffy on stating it as certainly as that, but then this is where we get into your opinions. With some thought, I could say that maybe there are at most four different types of “ki” in Street Fighter that we know of at the moment: “generic” ki, Psycho Power, Soul Power, and maybe ESP (think Gill with his cries of “Pyrokinesis!” and “Cryokinesis!”) that would probably be akin just be using “generic” ki for solely elemental based attacks. Obviously, however, you can see how flawed that is given that “ESP” would still be “generic” ki and Soul Power is some bastardization of Psycho Power is only sole (pun so not intended) difference is that it doesn’t seem to rely on negative emotion (of others; we all know how fucking depressed and depressive Rose’s fatalistic ass is).

Anyway, my point is what I’m going at least vaguely talk about for the rest of sentence and ironically I see that you sort of agree with me (if manipulate what you probably meant to say) in the six sentence. It’s not that the Hadou just allows people to “reflect” themselves with their ki; it’s ANY type of manipulation of Ki that can do that. The only reason that you probably think that is because the group that has most in-group ki variation within its style is that of the Hadouken-users (Sakura, Ken, Ryu, Gouki, and Sean).

Paradoxically, it should go without saying that your actual personality doesn’t influence your ki. Even if Gouki was “evil” or was “good”, which he isn’t, his attacks would all be the same, except for the fact that he wouldn’t use the Shun Goku Satsu if he was “good”. This is because it is a move that seems like it can only be lethal, as opposed to all of Gouki’s other moves, which he purposely makes lethal. Similarly, it’s not that Ryu has “‘good’ ki” just because he’s never killed anyway (and hell, he fucking cheated to win against Sagat) and he’s a “good” person (whose sole purpose in life is ultimately to be able to up anyone who challenges him).

Even if there were different types of “ki” depending on personality, which there aren’t, it’s not like you explain them. (So, for that reason, I have to assume that only reason that you said that is because Gouki and Ryu have different colored regular Hadoukens, purple and blue respectively. And thus Gouki is evil because Bison’s Psycho Power is also purplish.)

As for your last sentence, I would have to point out that not only did Bison explode because of his Psycho Power, meaning that it’s likely more powerful than any type of “Hadou”. More importantly, however, the “Dark Hadou” isn’t it’s only type of energy. It’s only a variation of the “Hadou” (if that even exists; I’d rather just say “a variation of the type of ki manipulation that the ‘Hadou-users’ use”, but you see that gets me nowhere…) that is “awakened” because the user stops giving a damn about holding back and wants to win at any cost, even cost of his/her opponent’s life. Even then, ultimately, the intensity of “Dark Hadou” still relies on the user. This means that only way that “Dark Hadou” is “stronger” than Psycho Power is if 3S Gouki is stronger than demi-god-esque SFA3 Bison.

However, like sano said, I’m not going to allow this to turn into a (full-fledged) versus thread.

Speaking of sano…

What the hell am I suppose to moderate besides deleted threads that I can still see?

I know that I’m lazy, but that just hurts… :sad:

Oh. Fuck it. Stoic mode reactive. I’ve some questions to ask, but I’ll wait for someone else to post so that I’m not double post.

Oh, which reminds me: Susano-o, please stop double and triple posting, especially on the same day. If it’s been three days or more than the last time that someone else responded (which is really generous, considering that it’s not like things are in danger of falling off the first page in this forum…), then it’s fine. Otherwise, no. Just edit your posts or I will do it for you.

69

They can’t be willed out of existence while holding up their flames. Their flames grant them invinsibility. As long as Kyo and iori are holding up their flames(like what they do before Orochinagi and Eight Glasses of Wine) Thanos cannot even do a thing to them. Also, it doen’t matter where Thanos is at, Kyo attacks your shell’s connection with your soul. That is hidden within a guild deep in between the ether dome of the Earth(Ever play Final Fantasy 10? It’s like the mana screen). And also, Thanos is not going to kill Kyo for no reason, he has to have motive. Chances are they would get into a political scuffle or something, Chizuru gets word, and then they end off fighting like that. Thanos also doesn’t even have an infinite amount of never ending magickal attack defense like Orochi(Orochi cannot die by any means anyway, all you can do is seal him). He couldn’t take one No Style. You forget, Kyo, Iori, and Chizurur don’t train to fight humans, they train to take out entities like Orochi, Gaea, and Thanos. Thanos is a god and The Sacred Treasures are God Calibur. That’s the name of their team. The God Calibur team.

All forms of entities have ki, even deities(exept Artificial life / Orochi has an infinite amount of never ending ki, meaning his power level is infinite multiversial when he is not holding back). Ki is the mid part of your soul. Thanos has a soul then Thanos has ki. His Ki is his lifeforce.

Destroying Orochi is like destroying yourself. You destroy the embodiment of life force and you destroy your life force and everybody elses in the universe as well. Orochi is not normally and entity to be fought. He is a deity. He has a place in the universe. It is his duty as a deity to rule over ki. That’s what his job is. You destroy him and you in essence take out your own lifeforce as well. It’s as simple as that.

Orochi adjoines on humanity by giving humans their ki. He also exists in the minds of all entities as a deity.

Obviously they were givin permission to use K’9999. If not then they would already been sued to hell for copyright infringement.

So why do you suggest they call him K-four-nine then. His name means the reset.

2 characters that look the same, have the same moves, have the same voice actor, say the same things, and have the same first and second forms(he used the white haired form in the manga) must be the same character. K’9999 is a tribute/homage to Tetsuo. Come on man, they’re the same person.

At the end of the of the movie Tetsuo’s body became transfigured and he caused a cosmic rebirth. Akira is just the source of his power. Doesn’t matter anyway because in KOF there is no Akira. Only K’9999. K’9999 is the source of his own power in the KOF continuity. He his universally potent.

K’9999 even has a full screen super in KOF '2002. The only other two people that I can think of to have full screen supers off the top of my head is Gill and Orochi. …Seems to me that developers of 2d fighting games only give full screen super edits to god potent characters(or atleast almost god potent in K’9999’s case)

70

Yes, they can. Even if they couldn’t, if Thanos was particularly bothered with them for some reason, he just go back in time using the Time Gem and kill them when they weaker/younger/unborn or even go further and destroy their ancestors.

See above. Also, this applies even if you meant “invincibility” (tricky word, that).

Even if Kyo’s attacks did attack your soul (which they don’t, given there hasn’t been a mention of “the soul” anywhere in KOF), Thanos’s Soul Gem would give him immunity if the attack actually had a chance of connecting.

However, given that even Thanos without the Infinity Gauntlet can move at like Mach 6. So Thanos moving at Mach 1 or greater while dodging would be a simple counter given that the resulting sonic boom would at least incapacitate Kyo, if not outright kill him.

Also, you do realize that you’re making your arguments even more ridiculous (granted, in general this is a rather absurd discussion given that we’re discussing about four or five equally fictional universes) by citing a nebulous of a game that has NOTHING to do with any of the universes being mentioned? (This is rhetorical.)

Um, actually, Thanos would probably kill the (relative to Thanos’s own power) gnat that is Kyo “for no reason” other than to impress Death…which is all Thanos needs and what Thanos most constantly wants to do. So Kyo is screwed.

You get points for being humorous by saying “political scuffle”, though.

Also wrong outside of Orochi’s (when we exclude IGod Thanos) immortality, which you have correct (gee, you have something right for once at this point).

Thanos’s Power Gem could probably easily give him an infinite amount of energy for attack or defense, though even a massive amount, like say, the amount it would take to blow up whatever city, country, continent, hell, planet, that Kyo is on, would be more than sufficient. After all, the best defense is a good offense.

Again wrong. Kyo, Iori, and Chizuru train to take out Orochi and ONLY Orochi. That’s all their fate is: To be the keeper’s of Orochi. Nowhere does it state in their celestial contract that they get to become Xena and take out random gods (which don’t exist, beyond Athena, who all of them could easily beat given how little time spends using her powers…damned girl). God Calibur Team just means that they only able to stand up to the god that is Orochi (and ONLY Orochi). NOTHING ELSE.

In SF and KOF, yes, all thing have ki.

Ki’s existence elsewhere (especially outside of fighting games) is as damned iffy as the existence of a soul.

However, I don’t even have to debate to you about their existence until you prove me links that Orochi is literally linked to everyone’s ki and is not just metaphorically linked to humanity by being a personification of destruction and a fucking telepath.

See above.

Actually, it’s not obvious, since I’ve seen no documentation or even heard word of such permission (and I’m sure that Lantis would have put something in his guide, or even Puar for that matter).

So, I wouldn’t be surprised that if besides K9999 being a massively unpopular rip-off of Tetsuo, that potential legal trouble would also be why where’ never going to see him again.

Again, give proof (read: provide some type of link) that “K9999” means “The Reset”.

You say it yourself. “K’9999 [sic] is a tribute/homage to Tetsuo.” Tribute to Tetsuo does not equal is Tetsuo.

Again. Tribute.

Again. No proof.

This is perhaps the closest thing that you have to a point in the entirety of your posts after you bring up “ether”.

Even then, it just points to K9999 being as strong as Gill or some bullshit like that, which isn’t surprising given the anime aspect of power that does tend to surround those that wield something akin to Kusanagi flame (which is why K’ and Kula and Krizald are also quite powerful).

Stop with the nonsense. This isn’t even (intelligent) speculation; this is baseless fanboyism.

71

I get it.

You’re baiting us.

Congratulations, you win. I mustn’t have noticed it in my old internet age.

72

Heh, heh, heh… Thanos doesn’t even know what ki is*

No, they can’t. Every generation there is a Kusanagi, a Yagami, and a Kagura who have to defeat Orochi. Doesn’t matter how far he goes back, he’s always fighting a Kusanagi(Orochinagi), a Yagami/Hakesshu(Eight Glasses of Wine), or a Kagura(Yata Mirror Seal).

Moving back instead of foward seems to me absurd my friend.

Now Orochi on the other hand, he’s more like Apocalypse. Orochi is always there(past, present, or future). Furthermore, Orochi is hidden deep within the ether dome of the Earth. The only people that can see(or even fathom him for that matter) him are Kyo, Iori, and Chizuru. Now, why can they fathom him? Because, they are God Calibur, that’s why. Their flames(what they use too see him with / they don’t necessarily see him as much as they sense him) act as an ether transport connection that allows them to sense things that are hidden deep within the ether dome of the Earth’s atmosphere. How do you demolish what you can’t see, touch, or feel? Answer; you don’t. It’s as simple as that. The reason Orochi flashes in and out like that is because he’s not even fully manifested into this worldly plane. The Sacred Treasures and Orochi fight inbetween the dimensions(deep inbetween the ethers). Is Thanos’ third eye(what is used to sense ki) that potent to the point that he can sense(using his ki) Orochi. Hell, Thanos is unfailiar with ki. He probably does not even know what it is. If he doesn’t even have a third eye/sixth sense then how can he even defeat Ryu? What Hadoken does is deminish your low ki. Fighters in the SF, and KOF univese train to increase there ki. If Thanos has never even increased his ki one notch that he can’t even take a hadoken. Hadoken = force + life force drain. It drains the life force/ki and hits with force(the force would not do a damn thing to Thanos but you know what? the ki would drain all of his life force directly).

Hell, Thanos probably doesn’t even have the sixth sense to even sense ki in geneneral. He couldn’t even sense RYU’S KI. Ryu can put Thanos to shame with a single hadoken simply because of the fact that Marvel failed to realize that ki = lifeforce in Marvel comics. Not that Ryu could beat Thanos but it’s just that Thanos would not be able to take a hadoken(he could probably destroy him from space or something)

Kyo and Iori don’t use their six sense/third eye/ki manipulatory sense to sense ki. They use their flames.

So get this. Thanos ki level isn’t even as potent as Ryu(hell, Sakura knows more about ki than Thanos) and Orochi HAS AN INFINITE AMOUNT OF NEVER ENDING KI. IF SUPER SAIYAN GAJILLION GOKU TRIED TO SENSE OROCHI’S KI HE’D PROBABLY DIE FROM THE RADIATION.

Perfect Cell has like a power level of 3 million. Orochi has like a power level of AN INFINITE AMOUNT OF NEVER ENDING. Perfect Cell rattles the Earth when he powers up. Orochi rattles the multiverse(several universes at a time).

THE RADIATION THAT OROCHI EMITS WOULD ERRADICATE SUPER SAIYAN 4322 GOKU SIMPLY BECAUSE OF THE FACT THAT NO MATTER HOW MUCH KI YOU HAVE OROCHI WILL ALWAYS HAVE MORE.

This applies to Kyo and Iori as well. Doesn’t matter how much attack or magickal attack they possess Orochi can just put his ATTACK OR MAGICAKAL ATTACK OVER THEIRS.

So, I bet you’re wondering how Kyo can even defeat one such as Orochi when Orochi has that much ki. Well, the answer is simple; Kyo’s flames have infinite magical attack as well(like what I said before about how if Ryu could even beat Kyo he would not be able to get hit by his flames, not even once). …But even with that he can only stagger Orochi. Yes, Orochi is that potent(so is Kyo, Thanos couldn’t even take a No Style)

Yes, Kyo and Iori are totally invincible whilst holding up their flames.

Kyo’s flames are a type of transparent etheral. Kyo is not necessarily “there” when he uses his flames. Etherals always harm the soul. It has already been outlined by Neo Rasa(a KOF storyline expert) in the KOF storyline thread that Kyo’s flames are an etheral. …And you’re saying that I’m doing nothing but just spouting off at the mouth… ? Tsk, tsk, tsk…

Orochi’s Bright Light(his full screen super) didn’t even kill Kyo, what makes you think that a simple sonic boom would?

So he DOES have motive, can’t argue with that…

Orochi told Chizuru “You have no plan, and no brain, how can you to defeat one such as I? I exist in the minds of all humans”(paraphrasing of course)

The whole mythology that KOF is based on states that all people get their ki from Orochi. Like I said earlier, a deity is a person who is adjoining on all people. Orochi is adjoining on all people by giving everyone their ki. He was around since before the universe created, what else do you expect?

“It all begins and ends with I” - Orochi

re-quote

“Destroying Orochi is like destroying yourself. You destroy the embodiment of life force and you destroy your life force and everybody elses in the universe as well. Orochi is not normally and entity to be fought. He is a deity. He has a place in the universe. It is his duty as a deity to rule over ki. That’s what his job is. You destroy him and you in essence take out your own lifeforce as well. It’s as simple as that.”

…Now you’re making sense.

endless laughter

73

Ok, hold on…before you all continue, I need a few hands up…if you say ‘Yes’ to any of the below sentences, put Hand Up if not , put Hands down This is the only way I can see if anyone is bullshitting their way through comparing between something he knows and something he doesn’t know about. And PLEASE, NO WIKIPIDEA!

How many of you Read the Infinity series, knows how Powerful ANYONE can get with any Infinity gem etcetc?

hand Up

How many of you know in detail, through reading up and knowing of Canon only material, know that Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet = True omnipotence in every sense, except ego?

Hand Up but wavering because it was a LOOOOONG time ago

How Many of you Know about KOF history and Canon material?

Hand raised halfway, then hovers because I stopped playing a few years back, but did continue reading the history and current storyline

How Many of you know about GG + Canon stuff?

Hands Down. Read but not too into it

How many of you know about SF + Canon stuff?

Does a Shoryuken and stays there

How many of you know what the word ‘Complete’ means?

Hand up

74

I think some of you are forgetting that every universe has it’s own set of rules.

For example, Marvel’s Ki is not nearly as powerful as it is in Dragon Ball Z. Which
means that if Iron Fist was in DBZ, he’d be a lot more powerful than he is in
Marvel. And since Ki isn’t as powerful in Marvel, DBZers would not be as powerful.

It’s how it works. No character can just “enter” another’s universe and disobey
it’s laws right off the bat.

Not to mention, if you have to ask who’s a more powerful character, you have to
go by feats demonstrated.

For all of Orochi’s power, it pales before Thanos w/ Infinity Guanlet for these
reasons.

-With the snap of a finger, Thanos eradicated HALF of the universe’s population.

-Defeated EVERY Cosmic Diety that rose up against him. The incarnations of laws
and concepts in the Marvel Universe, such as Galactus, Eternity, Master Order &
Lord Chaos, The Stranger, The Celestials, Hate & Love, etc.

And all were beaten without the slightest effort.

-Fought and defeated the Earth’s army. This consisted of Marvel’s best, and they
failed HORRIBLY. They couldn’t even hurt him.

-He created life, a living creature who exists in both life & death at the same time,
and one temper tantrum SHOOK the entire universe.

Orochi has never demonstrated this kind of power. EVER.

Not to mention that the Infinity Gems give him mastery over Time, Space, Mind,
Soul, Power, & Reality. The very things that embody what makes existence.

So in conclusion, Orochi cannot fight a being with that kind of power. To still say
he can is pure fanboy bullshit.

Until Orochi kills the entire Universe with the snap of a finger, & defeats the Gods
of his universe, he is clearly out of his league.

75

Snaps out of headache mode again

Videl learns to fly altho she’s human
Biggestestest example of the ease of DBZ Ki manipulation

Gets back to headache mode

76

The Damned - I didn’t mean that in a bad way, of course, sorry if you took it that way I apologize. For one thing this forum is really small, people for the most part get along okay, it doesn’t need heavy moderating anyway. Sorry again…

77

Orochi vs. The end thanos

The Embodiment of Ki vs the Embodiment of Everything (including Ki). Why is this even under debate?

78

Thanos is not the embodiment of ki. Orochi is, though. Orochi is a real deity in mythology who is the embodiment of ki(Shintoism). Thanos is a made up character. Deities have specific qualities that they adjoin on. For instance Gaea is the embodiment of lifestream, Orochi is the embodiment of ki, Mars(Greek god of war) is the embodiment of the fire element. Although I belive that Mars is a god and not a deity, though. Thanos is not even a deity because he is not adjoining on entities.

-Red Exodus-

Thanos is unfamiliar with ki. He has never trained with it. He can’t take a hadoken because if would drain all of his ki. It’s Marvel’s fault for not explaining and using ki manipulation more in their stories. Orochi can cut off anyone’summoning of ki bioloically. Meaning, if you fight Orochi you instantly have no life force, period. Orochi has a place in the universe as the embodiment of human life force. It is his duty to make sure no flukes pop up (that have to do with ki), that type of thing. There is a reason why he exists in the minds of all people(including Thanos’ mind). Thanos is a made up god with no real **purpose **other than to impress Death.

79

Ok i have to ask again, has everyone here talking about Thanos read the infinity series, and know about Thanos Canon? Please answer me everyone, because this will make a lot of things clearer about who is credible in this topic…

Actually, who here doesn’t even know that Thanos isn’t human???

80

I read the Infinity series, years ago though when it came out. Read some of the stuff again in Trade Paper Backs about 2 years ago. And I have his bio in a few of the Marvel Universe books that I can reference if needed. I have the Marvel Universe series from the 80s too that where a lot better.

Thanos??? Human??? I sure hope no one thinks that…

(I also hope this isn’t followed by a quiz, Thanos is far from my favorite Marvel character…)

81

Okay. this is obviously bait. No one is this stupid. I’m not telling you opinion I’m telling you fact. Well, I was anyway. Have fun with your one-handed circle jerk.

82

Nothing but the truth

…**Calm down **man I’ve never spoke anything but the truth in my life.

83

Regardless of whether or not you actually believe that, please just drop the business about Orochi (vs. Thanos), K9999, and the God Calibur’s team supposed invincibility. Otherwise, I will do something about your egregious trolling.

84

contributed more than anyone else to this thread

Me trolling…? …That’s new.

85

“…Calm down man I’ve never spoke anything but the truth in my life.”

Sorry but as you have said “I am my own source” and hence taking that statement, almost 90% of what you have posted is made-up… hence, counteracting this statement…

And Plz stop the Thanos VS. Orochi debate… and Random Nigga was referring to THANOS as the Embodiment of EVERYTHING (which includes ki, psycho power, kusanagi power and yadayada)… Plus, Orochi does not exist in thanos’ mind because Orochi however powerful he be is tied to Giae and hence his domain is earth (and more specifically, HUMANS) and Thanos is a TITAN… NOT A HUMAN…

Also K’9999 is not tetsuo and neither can cause a big bang… K’9999, 3 sacred weapons team, k’ and also most of the people you has mentioned are NOT invincible.

Critiques to your speculation:

Kyo’s flames -
biological control of fire (clearify on this… plz)
infinite amount of energy (incorrect the flames are tied directly to kyo’s life force) can boost him, moving speed (agreed)
condensed explosion, can biologically heat and burn things (agreed)
cannot be sealed by magick (incorrect Kagura’s seal can prevent it and I believe kyo’s metal/physical state has to do a great deal with the flame’s power…)
one touch explosion (agreed)

can sift out statuses, can fight diseases and viruses, invincibility,
flame’s transparent burn never dies(eternity burn), black hole effect, burn out in the wheel of time, automatic purgatory work(Clock Tower 3-esque if you’ve ever played it), instant max infinity achive(OD), , one touch lights the entire body on fire (no no and no… its a flame not a healing factor… it also does not stop time itself, unless you’ve been reading them Hong kong comics, the user’s power determine how long he can sustain the flame and it would take a god to sustain it forever KYO CANNOT sustain the flames for an eternity… and the flames DO NOT light the entire body on fire at one touch it acts as a regular flame, don’t see the game as a correct description of the flame’s working… Sonic boom moves nearly at the speed of sound (official statement) but it ain’t shown now is it?? )

(and the flames will hurt the user if he is not strong enough… it has been discussed in the SNK storyline thread…)

We need someone who has some official info on KOF… the facts and the fiction must be separated…