1

I’m just curious if anyone actually has a record of the feint frame data for all the TKs and Seismos. I’ve looked quite a bit, couldn’t find anything for feints. (I looked at the Viper frame data thread and all I see for any feints is… 6 frames of recovery. Not nearly as in-depth as I’m looking for)

Thanks in advance.

2

I guess you want to know how it affects frame advantage on normals.
Well, the theory is this :

  • You cancel a normal on its first hitting frame ( by buffering a special without late cancelling). By the way, frame data always gives the startup time so that the last frame is the first hitting one.

  • You input the feint (PP), you have a few frames to do it (not sure how many). Optimally, on the first frame of startup of the special. So you lose 1 frame at least here [Edit: in fact, probably not, corrected in the example].

  • You add the feint time.
    LP Knuckle Feint - 14 Frames
    MP Knuckle Feint - 12 Frames
    HP Knuckle Feint - 10 Frames
    Seismos - all the same, > 16.

[Edit: numbers from jaycetheace, seismo’s seems off. 13 frames seems probable]

  • You compare it with the total time for a normal : startup-1 + active + recovery.

Let’s see with c.hp xx hp tk feint :
8 + 10 = 18 versus 8 - 1 + 2 + 18 = 27 so you gain 9 frames and +2/-2 on hit/block becomes +11/+7. You can link easily with another c.hp (4 frames to link).

3

Ohh, okay awesome. Thanks for clearing that up. I wasn’t exactly sure how the feints work frame-wise to begin with, but now I know what I’m looking for.

4

Ok actually im curious as to how this works as well.
Crouch Hard Punch
Startup: 8
Active: 2
Recovery: 18
FABlk: -2
FAHit: +2

So drawing a timeline

Frame : 01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30
Start:…01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08
Active:…08 09
Recov:…10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27
FA:…-2.-1…0…1…2
FAblk:…O
FA Hit:…O

So at -2, is when your opp blocks and your opp can atk, and at +2 hit, you have 2 frames to do shit before they can.

For HP Fienting
Frame : 01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30
Start: x x x x x x x x
Active: x
TKfeint: x x x x x x x x x x
FA: 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11
FAblk: O
FA Hit: O

My main question is, how do you know the feint time? and the amount of frames?
According to this data, during a c.hp block feint…6 frame adv? thats huge…
10 frames for the next c.hp makes sense… i thoguht maybe even 9 frames?

Wow, my post doesnt even work…

5

If this data was true, we should be able to FFF with lpTK, since we can FFF with seismo cancel (1f).
But we can’t, from what I know. The numbers must be off somewhere.

6

It is possible to FFF with lpTK so the numbers are accurate.

7

Adding 1 lost frame between special startup and feint time is probably an error on my part, as you can link cl.hp, lp tk feint, c.hp:
9 + 14 = 23 versus 9 - 1 + 2 + 16 = 26, you gain 3 frames and +5/+0 becomes +8/+3, and you can 1f link c.hp.

FFF with seismo cancel also works from cl.hp. The link seems tight, probably 2 frames. So you should gain something like 4 frames by seismo feinting. 13 frames feint time maybe ?
9 + 13 = 22 versus 9 - 1 + 2 + 16 = 26

8

Edited out-
I just suck at execution, apparently. lol