How much damage does that do?
I would just go for cMK sHK -barrel loop- cLK sMK sHK jMP jHP -barrel loop- LP sMK cHP Cilia Slide to Bionic Car
But that’s only because it’s exactly like my typical BnB, except there I replace sMK with cMP so I can do a cMK cHP Heavy Buttslam after Cilia Slide since I still have the OTG left.
What im basically doing is the same thing but in a different order:
Otg jlk loop
Jmp loop
Rejump jlp,jmk xx barrel (land) cancel barrow into cats and apply wakeup pressure on the tech.
Its meh but its the best non wtf link shit i got at midscreen.
In corner double can omit the otg in various ways of course.
If it isnt a throw or assist pickup the the first combo goes into otg cr.mk,cr.hp xx hk bomber xx super
Also
Tested against val, it seems to be slightly delaying the barrel after jhk makes the link MUCH easier.
Dont have time to test agant other characters but judging how consistent it was (100%) im going that the barrel needs to be delayed slightly to get an easier link… Luckily this is pretty easy to do… Im excited, that was a very good question cause it pointed me in the right direction.
-Edit…Now that im testing it again, against both fortune and val, it seems to actually be slightly delaying jhk, though delaying jhk and barrel seem to do the trick as well. So i guess thats the secret… Delay jhk OR barrel, preferably both, by a frame or 2… No more. Then the link after avery is a peace of piss.
Could you clarify what inputs you’re using when you say “-barrel loop-”. Are you just pressing j HK to Barrel, or are you adding some more normals in there before? I’d like to practice a somewhat optimized version of this combo off of throw.
jLP jMK jHK barrel for the first loop, then jLK jMK jHK barrel for the second loop (or in reverse order, doesn’t really make any difference).
The jMP part in jMP jHP has to be delayed based on character weight, delay it more on lighter characters, and also mess around with the amount of hits it does (it should never do all). You should typically be able to tell visually how many hits it needs to do rather than counting them.
On Double you should jMP jHP sMP sHK because she falls super fast so you can actually restand her (actually you can only restand her, I don’t think it’s possible to catch her with jLK after jHP).
WOAH, my bad, I left off a complete chunk of the combo I actually try to do. Let me restate all this and break it up into sections so I don’t screw up writing it again:
Normal BnB:
cLK sMP sHK
jLP jMK jHK barrel
sLK sMP sHK
(delayed) jMP jHK (if on Double, add on sMP sHK)
jLK jMK jHK barrel
sLP cMP cHP Cilia Slide
cMK cHP H-buttslam Car/Cats/LVL3
Does about 6.6k without super.
Off of a throw:
cMK sHK
jLP jMK jHK barrel
sLK sMK sHK
(delayed) jMP jHK (if on Double, add on sMK sHK)
jLK jMK jHK barrel
sLP cMK cHP Cilia Slide Car/Cat Heads/LVL3
Forgot how much damage this does.
I haven’t done enough corner shit because I still can’t hit these properly enough anyway. Also, I have a super hard time switching from sMP to sMK for throw combos due to muscle memory, but I will do that eventually. The sMK does more damage, but if I use it I can’t do the OTG at the end (which doesn’t exist in the throw combo so no point in not doing sMK).
Dime, I am about to try what you said and if I can get cLK to connect 90%+ I will love you forever.
EDIT: Didn’t work (on Filia at least). Let me know if you have other ideas. I could just be sucking horrendously. Also tried on Fortune and no luck. I can’t goddamn progress until I have this kink worked out.
I retested today this morning against filia and added in pw… This works,very well and does make the combo much easier… As an example im very much considering changing the second loop from cr.lk to st.mk… Thats how much easier the link gets.
… But i have some time so ill test against fortune,bella and double… Be back here in a couple of minutes.
All you’re doing is delaying the time before the avery comes out, right?
Can you delay it too much and still combo? IE can I delay it, but delay it too much (and jMK will still combo into avery), but the link will remain hard?
I dunno, is there a sweetspot of delay that’s just 1 or 2 frames, and am I just not hitting that?
Oh, and according to the current shoryu wiki, Double’s cLK and sMK have the same startup frames.
You can delay it waaay to much and it will still combo… But the avery restand will be funky as shit…
Tried it against bella dubs and mf:
Mf = super easy to do it on… Easiest so far, could probably hit her with st.hp with as much on hit frame advantage as you get (not really… LOL, but the link is super easy)
Bella, hard to do it against her, but still viable. Feels like its between a 2 and 3 frame link depending on how the barrel and avery are timed.
Dubs, hardest by far, so far… Probably only a 1 or 2 frame link.
Yeah elk just keep practicin it… I couldnt get it for the life of me at first then i noticed myself dojng it more consistent and i asked myself what i was doing and i came up with delaying the barrel…
Barrel delay is the most important part, jhk delay is good as well but doesnt give as much control as barrel delay.
Also, idk if this has anything to do with it, but i do cr.lk,st.mkx2, launcher, jlk barrel loop, land (tight link here)
Since yeou use st.mp grounded and jlp first, it may be throwing something off, double combos can be finnicky like that.
-edit, st.lk feels easier i guess cause it hits lower on the juggled opponent creating the ability to hit in meaty frames unlike st.mk… Id explain the reasoning behind it, but just trust me.
Delaying the barrel is the key factor then, not the jHK?
I’m still not getting it at all. In fact when I stop trying to delay and just bust the whole thing out as fast as possible on Fortune it is working the most often for me. Let me try other chars.
Also, i think ive found a new combo convention that gives double near painwheel like resets:
Launch jlp,jlk,jmp,jmk (all 1 hit) land and either continue combo with st.lp. Or go for low/throw rest on landing, or go for jump crossup or go for assist dash crossup…
Looks really good and my current “bnb reset starter” if i wanted to make it one would be 5700 damage before the reset which is 1200 more damage than my pw reset starter pre patch and is 500 more damage than my pw reset starter post patch… Basically this is a very high damage non gimmicky reset with multiple mixup paths… I just dont know how applicable it is to every character since on hit advantage varies character to character cause of juggle weights differing.
I also think this can be done straight up after a throw or airthrow with no need to switchup normals besides not having 2 lk or mks up front (the otg and the restand cant be same button starter)
-edit
Lol numbers are wrong cause i was on 1.30
The reset is still completely applicable though.
Yep its the barrel that does most of the work.
No dont try other characters imho mf is easiest, practice on her.
i didnt mention this before cause i figured it goes without saying for anyone that already has barrel loops down… But MAKE SURE YOU GET YOUR J.LK AND J.LP’s OUT AS FAST AS POSSIBLE. If you dint it will throw everything out of wack.
Luckily post patch this is pretty easy since there is the 5 frame buffer making the first jump attack near auto timing for earliest input.
Keep practicin… I need to go to sleep, got a 12 hour day of lifting heavy shit coming up.
Thanks for the extensive posts! Enough said for now.
Aaargh, I feel like I need to have a video so frame by frame analysis could be done of this, because I’m just growing frustrating at failing and not being able to identify the cause of said failure (even if I know it’s apparently the barrel delay, I don’t feel or see the difference between when I can connect the LK versus when I can’t).
Also, not sure why I always used cLK to link versus LK, they have the same start-up but LK has 75 more damage…
I “think” ive figured out the difference between delay jhk and delay barrel:
Jhk delay basically lets double get grounded slightly fatser than normal versus her opponents regular fall speed.
Barrel delay creates more space between barrel and avery juggle, giving more frame advantage cause barrel has more time to recover.
Hope that helps, im not dong this frame by frame, just by feel.
And also maybe it is better to practice against someone other than fortune… Doing no delay against her still seems to result in a 50% chance to combo cr.lk… Basically cause the link is harder and sometimes it misses… So you wont be able to tell when you are delaying properly or not… Though the delay makes the link waaay easier.
Yall should probably prctice against bella, its nigh impossible to do against her with out the delay but not as hard as double.
If you get it off on double then you had to delay it correctly, i think its impossible without delay.
The problem with the jHK delay idea is that while Double gets grounded faster, Avery will have less airtime… so shouldn’t it cancel out?
This is SOOOOO frustrating. Mainly because sometimes I can get it to work 3x in a row, then fail 10x in a row, AND NOT KNOW WHY. AAAAAAAAAAAAARGH. THIS ISN’T FUN.
Dime_x, anyway you could post a video of what you’re doing by any chance compared to what not to do, or do you figure that wouldn’t be that helpful?
I might be able to but time is limited and i havent uploaded a vid to youtube in forever… It would just be my wife holding my ipad…
I cant do that till tomorrow cause i wont be back home till then, and since i havent been home in awhile (and im only home for 1 day), its kinda the last thing im thinking of doing…
But i can say that i dont have this nearly down 100%… I have no practice time and the timing is tricky in itself for the barrel delay… The thing is though i CAN tell when im going to drop the combo and when im not going to and what i did wrong.
You cant yet? I kinda just find that strange. I will hopefully be able to post a vid in a day or so, we’ll see.
Wat characters do you want it done on? Can only do 3 or so to keep the vid concise.
I haven’t had time to practice much myself, but thus far I still cannot tell when it will link vs. when it won’t.
And hey, no pressure of any sort, and you can do it on whichever characters you feel like. Just having the ability to visually compare what it should look like with and without delay might help me recognize the patterns in my own attempts.
Ok so I have bad news and worse news…
The bad is I won’t be able to get this on vid I don’t think.
The worse news is really bad though… I was testing all this out on an old CRT tv at my work… (we stay in random dorms kinda like hotel rooms) and on that tv I had the tinning down and could even see the combo points frame by frame… Well I got back home ready to try and record on my HDTV… But I couldn’t for the life of me reproduce the results that I could on the CRT. This is unnerving as it isn’t a lag issue. It feels like something else like the tv skips frames and the timing is no longer possible… Whatever it is I don’t find it being practical at all anymore.