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I normally play Dr Strange at mid but want to make a team centered around him to have him at point.

I was thinking Dr strange-dormmamu-hawkeye or dr-hawkeye-doom

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Well, they all have great and synergetic options… I’d recommend Strange-Doom-Hawkeye, since you can control more axis on the screen (which is pivotal for a point-Strange), but Strange-Dormammu can also wreck shop… Talk to Dreize, he’s the minister of Strange-Hawkeye affairs around here lol

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What do you guys think of his counter move: the Back H command? What does that do exactly? I’m guessing that is only for high attacks? He needs more help with defending at close range. He’s ass at it. :frowning:

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It’s a fast startup counter that works on moves that have moderate to severe recovery. Only works on moves that hit high, yes. You basically have to know its going to work before you do it. Useless on falling characters and you don’t always recover faster than someone who throws out a move like a fast normal for example. Little while back some tech came out that allows you to dash cancel after getting a confirmed Illusion but there’s no invulnerability so its super finicky. It’s a meh move.

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I actually think it would be a decent OS with a GTFO assist like Tatsu, especially with that dash cancel tech.

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On the subject of Flames of the Faltine negating Doom and Iron Man’s beams, I thought I’d toss in that it also negates Sentinel’s s.H.

Some thoughts and experiments on why this works the way it does:
It must have a special property, because the durability is what it says. It cancels out Wesker’s gunshot, which is 3 projectile hit points, so it must have the same value.

A lot of people just don’t understand how durability works. When they see Unibeam has “11 frames x 1 low priority durability points”, they think “oh okay, 11 durability”. And if you do something like Unibeam vs. two Hadokens, you’ll see that Unibeam wins. But that’s not all that’s going on. The Unibeam’s hit points drain differently from the Hadokens. Basically, the Unibeam rotates its hitpoints, and the more it loses, the weaker the beam becomes (thus if you Unibeam vs. Hadoken, Unibeam wins, but it hits fewer times).

If you pay close attention, though, you’ll notice that the Hadoken doesn’t get blipped out immediately. It has to be “worn down” as it chugs through Unibeam’s rotating frames. For this reason, even though 10 frames x 1 hit point is mathematically the same as 5 frames x 2 hit points, the latter is superior because it will grind down opposing projectiles faster.

This is why Flames of the Faltine won’t beat EMD, Psionic Blaster, or Mighty Spark. EMD L, for example, has 1 frame x 5 low priority durability points, so EMD L is basically the same as Hadoken in durability, and there’s no “grinding”.

This is also why Eye of Agamotto is a piece of shit. It has 10 frames x 1 low priority durability points, so it has to slowly “grind” down projectiles. It generally rocks beams because they grind each other down, but the following all pass through Eye of Agamotto:
Samurai Edge
Magnum
Hadoken

Yes, Hadoken > Eye of Agamotto. Basically, Eye of Agamotto is only able to grind through 4/5 of Hadoken’s hit points before Hadoken leaves Eye of Agamotto’s hitbox region. You can test this hypothesis by running Eye of Agamotto vs. Akuma’s Gohadoken. Gohadoken L gets eaten by Eye of Agamotto, while Gohadoken H passes through Eye of Agamotto. This can only be accounted for by considering the speed the projectile is traveling at, which allows for Eye of Agamotto to spend more time to grind the projectile down.

None of this explains why Flames of the Faltine beats Unibeam, Plasma Beam, or Sentinel’s s.H - it’s just a weird property (glitch?) it has. However, I tested all the beams in this game, and Flames of the Faltine only beats projectiles that have “# frames x 1 hit point”. So, it seems like Flames of the Faltine has a weird property that says something like “Unless the opposing projectile can beat Flames of the Faltine in a single hit, Flames of the Faltine will not lose durability”, which allows it to beat Unibeam, Plasma Beam, and Sentinel’s s.H.

Edit: Aaand I just proved my hypothesis wrong by testing Flames of the Faltine vs. Deadpool’s Trigger Happy, which fires 10 bullets that are 0.8 durability each. Trigger Happy grinds on Flames of the Faltine and wins.

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Someone with intelligence! I can’t possibly be on the Marvel forums anymore.

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Haven’t been on the boards lately due to work and life, but had to check back in after seeing Mazodyne made the front page of SRK with his Strange combos. Congrats, Mazio!

Anyway… I haven’t been playing much, but the last time that I did I switched up my team from Mag/Strange/Sent, to Trish/Strange/Doom. Still getting use to Trish, but what I like about her over Mag is her peek-a-boo assist, traps, and OTB air-super because in opening combos where I knock the opponent down with :s:, I can OTG tigerknee super, calling Strange EoA assist before I do for extra damage. Of course I’m still experimenting with this team, but it’s zoning oriented and it seems to work for me so far.

I use Strange’s :l: DoD quick often because it’s faster than :m: DoD. I use the :m: variation on knockdown or in appropriate situations where I know I’ll be safe from getting punished during recovery. Then I follow up with EoA, especially against teleporters w/out using IP so that they can eat it.

-Rotendo

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I messed around with this team for a while. Trish can start ToDs if you have 2 bars to spare at any time. The zoning/rushdown with Bolts assist is quite good too.

[media=youtube]5lWjljICt3M[/media]

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^ Sick! Going to have to start playing again and more often now.

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Flames of the faltine is like a tracking self repulsor blast. It’s used to defend against rushdown. Not really a projectile war tool. If they’re far away from you there’s not much need to utilize it. Once they’re far away you’re better off setting up your 1Y1R’s and Dagger L/M’s.

The FoF beating Doom Iron beam thing is just a little quirk and not something to really make a big deal about.

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That’s not true. FoF beating beams is an essential detail that you must keep in mind against those characters, like Doom. One of Strange’s strongest tools is EoA but that takes so long to start up and still can get mowed through by beams and hit him on start up. By throwing it out there, you can defend yourself from the beam and force them to block, while you throw down an Eye or Grace or even teleport behind them if they weren’t expecting the Flame to go through and hit them.

Setting up graces and daggers is good but remember those have long startup and people with projectiles will tag you even from far away, thus giving them momentum. A Flame or two in your neutral may help you in the long run, IMO.

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There aren’t too many situations where a Doom on point is going to do a grounded plasma beam vs. you. Once you get him to block one mystic sword he can no longer out shoot you on the ground any ways and has to take to the air. It may not be bad to throw around when plasma beam or unibeam are used as assists…but you’re not going to get much mileage otherwise.

Then there’s a whole slew of other characters like Magneto on point that will just blow it up any way and force you to go to Sword M.

Mystic sword M is what sets up spacing for agomotto and then you can always just use a fast assist to cover start up if needed. Mystic sword has its issues against some characters but otherwise that’s what you mainly use to get space for agomotto. Especially since there isn’t much any beam that mows through sword M.

Yeah a lot of people get mixed up on what EoA is supposed to do. Its not really a projectile war tool. Its more like a rushdown and anti rushdown tool. You can use it to set up block stun for pressure or mix ups or call it defensively to stop mix ups from happening to you. Its Strange’s main tool to keep him from getting put in a combo. If you’re in a projectile war there isn’t much reason to use it.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk 2

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You are at frame disadvantage when using mystic sword m & h…

The best way to get out an eye of agamotto is a red grace & or a FOF combined with it.

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Why red grace?

Magneto’s disruptahs are negative also but at least Strange’s pushes back on hit and block considerably. Which limits the amount of punishes that can be regular.

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk 2

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I’m not sure if you’re also considering that if you whiff Mystic Sword M you are put at a very long recovery state. At least Disruptor is very quick and not so bad on recovery. Someone like Mag can easily manuever around Mystic Sword (sometimes not even on purpose, just cause they’re just dashing around). Sword is definitely a good way to force a block but I feel like FoF is better since it’s at least high enough to stop tridashers and recovery is quick enough to react to things.

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Because it causes an explosion that pushes back and leaves you at frame advantage as well as slight tracking.
There is also way less recovery on the FOF.

So you can do something like put down a red grace. see if they rush at you, neutral jump & shoot off a fof, that causes an explosion beneathe u , tracks slightly to them and allows you to put out an eye of agamotto.

Its also great cause should someone touch a FOF, you can instantly fire off another one all while being at frame advantage.

Mystic Sword M pushes back but against faster characters your at such a frame disadvantage you have to block their next attack if they rush at you.
Mystic SWord M clears up durability from fullscreen distance or as a blockstring when you need space but its def not the best option to get out an eye.

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Hey, I know this is a huge necropost, but I thought this thread was extremely useful, and it seems a shame to let it die. Strange’s zoning with specific assists seems like a good thing to flowchart.

Right now I’m thinking of Strange sequences with a naked flame to start, that uses Taskmaster’s up arrows assist. The string I currently like most is:

flame, eye, fH+Taskassist into (MOVE), TK M Daggers, flame, eye, repeat for as long as possible.

It doesn’t use graces, which I know is silly most times, but I find this still manages to cover vertical space great thanks to daggers M and Task’s arrows hitting in close succession. It seems uber safe, and the most consistent way I got close against it when training was to cr.M with Ammy, who’s cheating anyway, because she crouches the flame.

In the middle, there’s a lot of safety, so (MOVE) depends on the situation, it can either be dagger L (catches approaching air mobility the best, leaves a slightly larger gap right before the flame), Dagger M (bitchier to get close to on the ground, catches superjumpers much more often), or Mystic Sword M (catches short people better and provides a chunk of durability against anyone who thinks they can punch through from a distance). Felicia seems to be able to get through the Sword M variant if she’s smart, be warned.

Any thoughts? I’m kinda new at this zoning flowchart thing, and I’d love suggestions based on specific matchups or even general tweaks to my idea.

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[Edit at start of post: Wow, just went back and read this thread in its entirely. Such great stuff, all! I think the below still holds up, but def have fun new weapons. The stuff about needing top of the head coverage tempts me to go Jam Session over Cold Star (as I def wanna keep Plasma over Missiles), but I think even as is it’s still beast. So to those that posted many months ago… anything new?? :slight_smile: ]

Nice work, Duke. As you well know, this is the shit I’m interested in as well. I hestitate to post my own sequences as I always assume the regulars here already have much better stuff, but if it helps to at least spark the discussion, here goes.

Depending on the matchup, I’m generally trying to flow an Eye into an Eye into an Eye, with Plasma Beam (or comparable assist) helping to fill in gaps and/or protect the next Eye-n-push (by ‘push’ I mean to Palm the Eye). After a successful Eye, to get to the next Eye, I’ll try to free flow stuff like:

-Push, call Plasma, Eye
-Jump yellow, land, push, Flame or another yellow then flame, Eye
-Push, M Dagger, Eye or call Plasma then Eye
-Eye, yellow or red, Push, call Plasma, Eye with the idea of already having a grace out for a future sequence
-Push, Yellow, L Dagger, Eye, call Plasma, Push, Eye

And many more, just generally trying to free flow ways to get me to the next Eye safely and keep the locks long enough for cool down to not present a problem (easier said than done, but it’s the goal). Matchups definitely matter though since getting a bunch of Eyes may not be so effective as discussed above. But in those cases there are other weapons that are. And if there’s a character against whom Strange just doesn’t have any zoning play (I want to know who!?), just let one of your other characters fight him/her.

Then as all this goes on, keeping in mind:

Any detected button press = free SoV (or THC if your team’s strategy calls for it, like xxx Strange Ammy does)
Any detected attempt to blow through = 7 Rings
Any detected frustration and/or hesitation can = teleport in for a mixup or lockdown-into-mixup

This may be highly debatable, but I personally consider Strange (and even more controversially Morrigan) in the same camp as Dormammu where they are SOOO much better entering the game with momentum/meter/time to set up shop, that I just can’t see wanting them first (Morrigan exception, but I still prefer her 2nd). I still want Strange in with 2 assists, as a ‘virtual first,’ but let someone good at the opening battery for a bit THEN DHC/TAC/hard tag Strange in and go nuts. If the opponent forces the first hit and you’re left w/ Strange incoming, I dont think that’s an argument against this strategy, as if they’re getting the first hit against a Magneto or Nova or whoever, they were probably gonna own Strange too anyway. lol

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So what would be the best way to setup eye and zoning with my team Dorm/Strange/Dante?

I am thinking FOF, jamsession Eye, into zoning sequance?