I haven’t actually seen it in person, simply because no one seems to play her around here… is Yuri. She can do the shoshosho as well…
Are you serious? I think K is like LAST against A-groove. :lol: So what if you are going to get a level 3 for about…7-10 seconds after you eat a damn sak shoshoshoshosho that takes like 70-75% of your life. I mean really though…you have to capitalize the moments that A-groove doesn’t have meter, or else you die trying to fight when they do have meter. imo, the order to defeating a-groove is like this…C, N, A or S, P, K. At least p-groove has a constant super bar so they actually have to block good for the duration of the match, more than 10 seconds.
A>>>>>>>>>>>>>>K…i wish there was a bas vs Ino match…oh wellz.
I am still going to play k-groove…but don’t ever think K vs A is anywhere NEAR even…its mad slanted…think mag vs cable in MvC2, and randy lew is ino:lol:
With K-Groove Some Chars take too much Damage like Sagat and Mai I don’t like to fool around with it. I’m N and P Grove user!
People saying that K is awful against A are probably the ones that always fall for A-Groove traps. And you’re not always fighting Sakura when someone is using A-Groove. Many good A-groove characters don’t have very good guard crushers, and even if they do…
If you know when a CC is coming, then you can take steps to either avoid it or brace for it. If you can’t get out of the way of one, big deal, you’re blocking it (if not JDing the first few hits). If you’re in any other groove without meter, you’re going to get your guard crushed just like you will in K-groove. Even if you do escape it with a counter, you’re going to lose a giant chunk of your GC anyway, still leaving you vulnerable and the other guy with some meter leftover.
Yes, your GC meter is 10% less in K, but when your guard finally does go, your defensive bonus will kick in, and drastically minimize the damage. I’m not 100% sure about this, but I believe the overall damage you take from a guard crushed Sakura CC in K-Groove is basically the same you’d take from a C, A, N and S-Groove guard crush CC. P-Groove is the worst, as the GC meter is 20% less than normal, and you’re not going to get the defensive bonus.
Granted, there are escapes to a blocked or anticipated CC in those grooves, but if you’re going to get hit by one no matter what, which is usually what happens with really good A-Groove players, you’re going to rage and get the defensive bonus very quickly (if don’t have it already). This is really useful when you see a CC dwindling down your life, and, coupled with your low life defensive bonus, a combo that might kill you in any other groove will keep you alive thanks to rage, and leave you with a Level 3+ super in the bank after it’s over.
I fight against plenty of A-Groove teams, including plenty of Sakuras, and I have no problem dealing with them in K-Groove, and this is coming from someone who has used N-Groove for two years. If I know when one is coming, I can throw out a quick dodge or counter with Hibiki, backwards run with Maki, or Giant Bomb with Raiden. A simple backdash works when they go for air activation too. Of course, it does matter which characters you use, and how well you can JD. But basically, when I go against a really good A-Groove player, I know that even if they land a full or partial combo on me, I’ve got rage, and I’ll just give back the damage that they gave to me (plus interest) after they finish up. If I don’t land the super afterwards, that’s fine too, because I’m going to get my meter back just as fast (or faster) as they’re going to get theirs back, so I actually invite A-Groove players to try to CC me. I just love it when they need to run away from me after they land a combo.
Well, at least the smart ones do.
I was at the arcade when someone Activated and tried to sho me.
Fast thinking and luck were there as I countered the Sho and shut her down.
Really, the only A-characters that hurt k-groove are the ones that do massive block damage with dps such as sak, iori, kyo and break your gaurd…k groove shouldnt really be woried about anything else because even if you get your gaurd broken you will not take a lot of damage and you will get meter from it…
but if you are playing against a good sak you WILL loose 80% of your life…
also if im not mistaken taking block damage from saks gaurd crush doesnt fill your meter so you will be loosing a lot of damage and gaining little meter…on tpp of that you have to work around her RCed hurricane kick and fireball, the hurricane kick really hurts k because even if you jd the thing i think she still has frame advantage…and its hard to hit sak after her fireball if you JD it…
im outi
Roberth
Your meter does not fill when blocking anything, but the fact is, it’s going to break eventually, which it does with all the other grooves anyway. I’m just saying it’s not nearly as bad after it breaks, since you will rage almost instantly, and won’t take nearly as much damage.
If you JD all the hits of a RC hurricane kick, you won’t get pushed back like you would if you were just blocking it. You get a free throw after she lands. Also, while it’s true that you really can’t do anything after you JD a fireball, as long as you keep JDing all or most of the hits of the fireball, the advantage will start swinging in your favor, as you will get back more life than she can chip off, and your meter will fill up after 12 or so JDs.
I don’t think you can throw sakura for free after JDing the hurricane. Except with Gief’s SPD.
For the short hurricane kick, probably not. For everything other than one hit, you’ll be fine, because you won’t get pushed back. Since you’re not getting pushed back, and she’s coming into you, logic would dictate that when she lands she’ll be in your throw range. If she’s not, you can walk up a few pixels to get into it.
I know this works because I use the characters with the most extreme throw ranges: Hibiki’s throws have the shortest range in the game (44 pixels) and Raiden has the largest (80). I always get a throw off if a Sakura uses a stronger version of the HK (with or without the follow-up kick) if everything gets JDed no matter who I use.
Nothing to do with ranges. It’s just the fact that she recovers before you do. I’m talking about RH hurricane btw.
well, Maybe not, I dunno. I know she can’t jump out of a perfectly timed SPD anyways. But I don’t think you can throw her. Not “for free” anyways. I think she can just jump if she wants to.
Look at it this way. I can’t FAB her after JDing all the hits of the hurricane. I don’t know the startup numbers on it, but I’m guessing it’s less that a throw. I’ll go check it out to make sure.
2 words (if you count the number): Evolution 2002
Ino defeats BAS, quite dramatically if you will (Blanka’s c.roundhouse)
oh…i didn’t see the bas vs ino then, but still…i don’t mean a-groove counters k-groove, but i mean, a-sak is a k-groove killer…and if you tell me the defensive or offensive boost is worth it…i’ll juss call u nuts. Really…why would you not use A-Sak in ur a-groove team, sakura herself can dig an insurmountable hole for k-groove to get itself out of
Ino’s better than Bas anyway. A is the best counter groove for K, although it’s not a free win for A.
actually i think sak sucks HAHAHA IMO shes only good against p/k all other grooves she is not top tier against…of course this is just IMO…
im outi
Roberth
A-Sak is THE top tier, followed by C Sagat. And she can back it up, her moves are good when RCed (Hadoushou= Good chip esp vs P/K, RC hurricane is good for corner traps) she has great normals too (s.roundhouse and c. roundhouse have the same range) and her throw range is greater that many other characters.
But then again your post was IMO…
Everyone has the same throw range. It’s just really deceptive with smaller characters like Sakura so it looks like she can throw really far.
Actually no, they don’t.
The base throw range is 52 pixels. Virtually everyone’s range is this, though since some characters are larger than others, it might appear that some of the smaller characters suck you up, but that’s because you’re closer to them than you think you are. This also applies in reverse to larger characters in that it looks like you’re far away from them, but you’re probably in their range as well.
Of course, there are exceptions to throw ranges:
Hibiki’s and Yun’s throws are 44 pixels. I can tell you this from experience, having a short throw range sucks.
Maki’s punch throw range is a bit larger than normal, at 60 pixels. Both of Rolento’s throws are also 60.
Chang’s throws are a bit larger at 64 pixels.
Raiden’s punch throw range is an ungodly 83 pixels. You can suck up anyone foolish enough to try to tick throw him. I can tell you this from experience, having a huge throw range is awesome. 
To keep this in the K-Groove perspective, if someone throws any sort of medium or hard attack at you, and you JD it, that usually gives you enough time for a throw in most cases. With Hibiki, that’s almost never the case unless they’re right next to you, as I’ll throw out an easy to punish fierce or roundhouse since they’re just out of her throw range (but in the range of anyone else).
Of course, a Just Defend is not a parry. A big mistake that a lot of people still learning K-Groove make is they think that after a JD, they’ve got all the time in the world for a throw or jab/short combo. Not the case. Even I’m still guilty of getting a bit agressive when I should be JDing/blocking, especially in jump-in situations. Throws still have startup time, and all JDs do is reduce your blockstun, meaning trying to throw instantly after a JD will just open you back up to an attack if someone is doing a jab/short or otherwise quick combo of their own, instead of being stuck in blockstun like you would be if you were just blocking.
This brings us to the characters with the bigger throw ranges. If you’re fighting a character with one of the larger throw ranges, you might not want to JD all of their closer quick attacks. (In fact, don’t even get near them unless you have a plan.) If you are expecting a quick attack from your opponent, and you JD it, you might be in for some trouble. Remember that a Just Defend puts you a special, shorter kind of blockstun. The keyword there is shorter. Remember that you can’t be thrown while in blockstun, but if your blockstun becomes shorter than normal, your window to be thrown opens sooner. You could get thrown before you know it, which holds especially true with these characters with the extended throw ranges, as they can either be slightly further away, or would need to move foward less in order to chuck you.
Of course, this really only applies if you’re expecting a quick flurry of crouching attacks from the maximum jab/short range, and they only stick out their fast one once. While you will usually recover at basically the same time as your opponent does (if not a bit sooner, but keep reading), they can throw you almost right away since you’re not in blockstun anymore. The big range throws will suck you up in no time. While many characters with normal throw ranges can do this with tick throws, the main difference here is that there is far less time to see it coming.
If someone hits you with their slower jab/short move, and you JD it, you’ll likely recover a bit before they do. However, this presents a slight problem: If you advance forward for a throw or attack, you’re likely to still be thrown (still talking about vs. characters with larger throw ranges) or at the least, teched. If you attack right away, you run the risk of either trading or getting outprioritized if someone doesn’t try for a throw and continues attacking, or possibly still getting thrown anyway. This means that you could have no advantage by JDing the original hit, at the best trading or forcing to be tech thrown.
This throw situation is one of the many reasons why it’s not too smart to JD every move you see coming. It’s been discussed before why you need to be careful against some of Cammy’s moves, etc. But here’s a reason why you need to be careful when fighting against a K-Groove Raiden (me), Maki (me), Chang, and Rolento. That quick JD you see coming might just get you tick thrown, because you made that tick a lot quicker. One of the big keys to K-Groove is not only knowing when to JD, but also knowing when not to.
ya it was IMO because IMO rc hurricane kick and fireball are ineffective against roll grooves and grooves with alpha counters, AND the only poke she has is s.rh thats really any good, she has no air game, bleh i dont see how footies of her s.rh is really that good cause i have no problem getting around it with anyone, even sagat. like i said shes only top tier against k and p…
im outi
Roberth
Her air game is dive kicks. She owns the ground with s.hk, random RC Fierce fireballs through footsies, and random RC hurricanes.
… oh man I dont even have the patience…