21

Fei beats gief slightly.

22

I actually agree with this. There aren’t many elite ones out there but playing a good one can be maddening as fuck. Obviously the fireball barrage bullshit is bad enough to deal with but she has good normals to keep u out as well and she can stuff lariat pretty easily to. All that combined with her annoying ass voice can make u wanna throw ur stick.

I put her as a 5-5 mu though cause u can destroy her pretty quickly once ur in her face. Her wakeup options are limited and if she makes 1 or 2 mistakes then she’s dead. As usual getting in is the tough part.

23

Wow, I guess you can tell which matchups some of you guys need more experience in.

User UltraDavid voted on zangief
viper: 4.5
guile: 4.5
bison: 5.5
chun: 3.5
deejay: 6.0
guy: 6.5
seth: 3.0
ibuki: 4.5
vega: 5.0
fuerte: 6.0
dudley: 6.0
sagat: 3.0
cammy: 5.5
makoto: 6.0
dhalsim: 4.5
rufus: 5.5
gouken: 5.5
adon: 5.5
ken: 4.5
hakan: 5.5
rose: 5.5
akuma: 4.0
balrog: 4.5
honda: 4.0
dan: 6.0
sakura: 5.5
gen: 5.5
ryu: 4.5
hawk: 5.5
fei: 4.0
cody: 7.0
abel: 5.0
blanka: 4.0
juri: 3.5

24

Also glad most Giefs have come to their senses realizing Abel is not a pushover. That match seems very even now-a-days, at best slight advantage Gief.

@UD. Gief beats THawk?

25

I am pretty surprised as to the variety of numbers for Sim. I think of this as 6/4 for Sim at the very least closer to 6.5/3.5. I must just suck at the matchup lol.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

26

User IronZhangief voted on zangief
viper: 5.0
guile: 4.0
bison: 5.0
chun: 3.0
deejay: 4.5
guy: 5.0
ibuki: 5.5
seth: 3.0
vega: 4.5
fuerte: 5.0
dudley: 6.0
sagat: 3.5
cammy: 5.0
makoto: 6.0
dhalsim: 4.0
rufus: 5.0
gouken: 6.0
adon: 5.5
ken: 4.5
rose: 4.0
hakan: 5.0
akuma: 3.0
balrog: 4.5
honda: 4.5
dan: 7.0
sakura: 6.0
gen: 6.0
ryu: 4.0
hawk: 5.0
cody: 6.5
fei: 4.5
abel: 5.0
blanka: 4.0
juri: 3.5

27

User Grimmjow316 voted on zangief
viper: 5.5
guile: 4.5
bison: 5.5
chun: 3.5
deejay: 5.0
guy: 6.5
ibuki: 4.5
seth: 3.0
vega: 5.5
fuerte: 5.5
dudley: 5.5
sagat: 2.5
cammy: 5.5
makoto: 6.5
dhalsim: 5.5
rufus: 5.5
gouken: 6.0
adon: 5.5
ken: 5.0
rose: 5.0
hakan: 7.0
akuma: 4.5
balrog: 5.0
honda: 4.0
dan: 6.5
sakura: 5.5
gen: 6.0
ryu: 5.0
hawk: 4.0
cody: 6.5
fei: 4.5
abel: 5.0
blanka: 3.5
juri: 6.0

28

tonsetzer voted :

viper: 5.0
guile: 4.5
bison: 4.5
chun: 3.5
deejay: 5.0
guy: 5.5
seth: 3.0
ibuki: 5.0
vega: 4.5
fuerte: 4.5
dudley: 6.0
sagat: 4.0
cammy: 6.0
makoto: 6.5
dhalsim: 4.0
rufus: 5.5
gouken: 4.5
adon: 5.5
ken: 5.0
hakan: 6.0
rose: 5.0
akuma: 3.5
balrog: 5.5
honda: 4.5
dan: 6.5
sakura: 6.0
gen: 6.0
ryu: 5.0
hawk: 4.5
fei: 5.5
cody: 5.5
abel: 5.0
blanka: 4.0
juri: 5.5

29

I think most Giefs suck at this MU, but I’m trying to step out of my box and look at it objectively. All the “name brand” Giefs I see play sims make him hard earn his W. Arguably the best sim in the country gets blown up every so often by the best Gief in the country so to say its 7-3 Sim seems ridiculous IMO.

I personally feel its only slight advantage sim. (5.5) Gief has all the tools and the heath to push him to the corner, then rape his escape attempts. Problem is patience and tricking sim to use the wrong AA.

Arturo actually came on srk and once said even in super he thinks it adv Gief. I looked at him like a loon esp since I’ve never seen him struggle vs any Gief like ever, Not even Aqua. But he might know something that some of us are missing. :bluu:

30

… Id rather think that you have never played any good dhalsims. Not to offend anyone… But, playing against some of my friends DHs, we play about even. Even though he’s kind of rubbish. If you play vs a DH that has something between his ears, he will know that he can throw a FB, then wait to see how gief reacts, and he will atleast have like a whole second to counter it…

In addition Gief vs. Dhalsim is alot better for gief online, than offline. Offline DH becomes a beast on priority, not even gief can handle that.

When a DH player gets U2, it’s 90% certain to land, unless the gief dies before he attempts another jump.

A super is almost always bound to land.

When gief gets DH in the corner, something that is not supposed to happen based on DH’s insane priority. it only takes one good guess to get out, and gief will most certainly be low-low on HP.

Instead of DH trying to throw out s.hp at fullscreen, he can wait for the random short lariat and either A: Sweep, or B: s.hp/c.hp Rendering the short lariat knockdown tactic useless. Ofc most online DH’s will not think of this, and keep on throwing unsafe and random limbs.

In my expirience, the more you try and play the vanilla matchup, the worse of you will be. In super your best hope is to go completly insane, and get him in the corner and be great at ur c.lk links and setups/reads. Trying to slowly look for an opening will only force you to eat tons of chip/cheap dmg, and put you back to the corner. EXGH Shenanigans will not work on a good DH either.

If you ever play a non-flowchart sim offline, im so sure you would agree. :smiley: But ofc, it might just be me who really sucks shit.

I am sorry for not spellchecking, and adding all the correct … things… :stuck_out_tongue: If its really bothering anyone, il do it in my next post.

31

i’d say from full screen it’s like 9-1 sim and in the corner it’s like 8-2 gief.

32

I literally just portion 75% of my life bar and say to myself, “Spend this to get in once”. Once you are in it is a buffet. I am not great or anything but I have played Henry Cen’s Sim a couple times and it was no fun at all. However the one time I got in it was not a pretty site.

33

Pretty much this. The entire match is walking Sim to the corner while eating damage and then obliterating him in the corner with pressure. If Sim escapes the corner you more than likely lose the round. Smart Sim can make this a frightening matchup.

34

Walking sim to the corner is quite hard when blocked and hits push you back, alot. Pushback ftw!

It is indeed 9-1 to Sim from fullscreen, which is why id say the matchup is in total 8-2 sim, or at the very least a 7-3. Because, if you DO get in. You can end it. But if the Sim is good, it shouldnt happen. :stuck_out_tongue:

Im more intrested in understanding why everyone thinks chun li is 7+ vs gief and sagat only around 6.5

35

Chun has an absurd ground game and dial a button anti airs that pretty much shut Gief down. Chun can anti air with cr. Hk, df. Lk, ST. Hk, cr. Mp, nj hp, j. Hp, (both of those juggle to U1, U2, Ex sbk, or stomps btw) air throw, and ex sbk. WTF.

Add to that a fireball and walk speed that would make the Flash envious and you have a character that controls a LOT of space in front of her. It’s similar to fighting Sim without as much range. You have to take U2 to make her think twice on wakeup as well which isn’t as damaging as U1 and in many cases is harder to land. For reference, watch Haneyama vs. Zangitan or Ricky Ortiz vs. Vangief. The matchup sucks. Sagat sucks too, but his damage got nerfed and most Gief mains have been dealing with him for a long time and know some stuff that works in our favor.

Chun is just a nightmare for Gief.

36

Hmm. Sagat forces you to move towards him, with a dangerous fireball game, very damaging one hits, and an air to ground trade that renders jumping a go at the bingo.

Chun lis is fast, and has good pokes. Her normals can AA, but they will most likely trade in your favor, and if you dont abuse jump, you can offen catch her off guard and overriding the poke. Noone is forcing you to hold forward when playing against Chun Li, if you block her pokes and use your buttons wizely, meaning: You have to use footsies, not s.mp. Her FB are very easy to avoid, slow on startup, easy to EX-GH through, NJ. to cancle it out. As long as you use your 99 seconds, it cant be more than a Strong 6-4 in chuns favor.(This is ofc, based on my expirience) Buffer c.lk into EXGH to punish c.hk, and Buffer c.lp into EXGH to punish other pokes, easier said then done. But usable.

You can punish sagats s.rh with c.lp / s.lp / c.lk buffer exgh aswell, but his fireballs force you to keep on moving onwards, there is no place you can just HOLD, as your own. Without loosing life slowly. I favor a Chun over a Sagat anyday.

I dont think you can use extreemly even matches, between very good players where the giefs lost this time around, as an ultimate guide to matchups. Vangief lost to Bison, Balrog and Abel the last time he played them. I find theese matchups pretty balanced though.

37

My best defense to your example is to go watch the matches I indicated in my first post. If anybody knows how to play footsies with Gief it’s Vangief and Zangitan. Didn’t get them too much traction.

My definition of a bad matchup is one in which you have to play vastly superior to your opponent to win. That is the case with Chun Li. It’s not unwinnable, but it’s bad and I have been face rolled by very average Chuns when I didn’t bring my A game.

38

Zangitan has footsies? ^^

I did watch Vangief vs. Ricky Ortiz. It was really close, even matches.

39

Did you watch the matches from keystone? Or evo top 8? The keystone matches are more recent and features all of the current anti Gief technology.

Don’t doubt the Zangitan yo. No magical girl has ever played Gief that well!

40

LoL ^^

Nahh, but i believe that even pros can have faults in their gameplan, even though their play is absolutely amazing.

Chun is a major pain, but no more than Sagat. Fortunately there are no really strong Sagats that has raised the bar lately that can show us why we hate the one eyed mo… =)