Chun-li Video/Discussion Thread

[amigdala]

i didnt know chun could punish jab srk with cr.fp xx mk bird after instant block… good stuff.

throw in super afterwards and its 528 damage.

-dime

super= waste of ex imo

[Dime]

^^^… lol everybody is entitled to one.

500 burst non ultra damage is good for chun though… sometimes we have super in the 3rd round…

yet another high damage way to let it go.

-dime

[MagnetoManiac]

[media=youtube]O7BZ7uFof6Y[/media]

Fuudo vs Haneyama

Hane yam yams learns the hard way not to be throwing them kikos in jump range. His game plan looked pretty freestyled, I can tell he wasn’t comfortable with the match up. It’s a good video on what to watch out for, though.

[Ikaru]

[media=youtube]O7BZ7uFof6Y[/media]

Fuudo vs Haneyama

Hane yam yams learns the hard way not to be throwing them kikos in jump range. His game plan looked pretty freestyled, I can tell he wasn’t comfortable with the match up. It’s a good video on what to watch out for, though.

I learned from that match not to pick Chun against Ryu…

I’d still pick her. >_>

[Dime]

Man that seems impossible. After I read about it here, I went into training mode and tried it…even on counter hit it never worked.

Then I let my buddy try it…this guy was a solid 3s tourney player and his execution is scary good…and even he didn’t get it in about 10 tries.

Is there a particular super (short, forward, roundhouse) that you have to use?

Must…try…harder…

ch doesnt change the combo at all… only the first hit in multi hit moves counts as the counter.

the way i do the combo is to plink mk~lk and them negative edge them…

also your probably doing this, but if not , you need to make sure that you input the mk sbk with a motion that never goes through neutral… iow from down back to upback… that way you dont lose the charge for super when you execute the mk sbk.

good luck :tup:

-dime

[Skatan_Milla]

I learned from that match not to pick Chun against Ryu…

Why, the matchup is only slightly in the favor of Ryu, it might even be an even matchup if you ask me?
I don’t know how it is for everyone else, but for me it’s possible to hk hazanshu over fireballs as guaranteed punish on reaction, but I have to be thinking about the fireball at that moment for me to react fast enough.
So basically if you do that effectivley Ryu needs to start getting his damage in through other ways than fireball setups and opens up an easier way for Chun to stay on the ground.
A big problem in the beginning is learning how to look for fireballs and hk hazanshu them while also at the same time being able to punish jump-in attempts with far mk/cr.hp/cr.mk.

[Ikaru]

Why, the matchup is only slightly in the favor of Ryu, it might even be an even matchup if you ask me?
I don’t know how it is for everyone else, but for me it’s possible to hk hazanshu over fireballs as guaranteed punish on reaction, but I have to be thinking about the fireball at that moment for me to react fast enough.
So basically if you do that effectivley Ryu needs to start getting his damage in through other ways than fireball setups and opens up an easier way for Chun to stay on the ground.
A big problem in the beginning is learning how to look for fireballs and hk hazanshu them while also at the same time being able to punish jump-in attempts with far mk/cr.hp/cr.mk.

You’re right, but it’s just those devil may care Ryus throwing srk after srk with no thought of the repercussion freak me out. Pass that, I don’t think it’s a super tough match, but they still give me trouble from time to time.

[System_1]

You’re right, but it’s just those devil may care Ryus throwing srk after srk with no thought of the repercussion freak me out. Pass that, I don’t think it’s a super tough match, but they still give me trouble from time to time.

Just make the risk vs reward in your favour. Punish whiffed SRKs hard.

[Hoffburger]

Why, the matchup is only slightly in the favor of Ryu, it might even be an even matchup if you ask me?
I don’t know how it is for everyone else, but for me it’s possible to hk hazanshu over fireballs as guaranteed punish on reaction, but I have to be thinking about the fireball at that moment for me to react fast enough.
So basically if you do that effectivley Ryu needs to start getting his damage in through other ways than fireball setups and opens up an easier way for Chun to stay on the ground.
A big problem in the beginning is learning how to look for fireballs and hk hazanshu them while also at the same time being able to punish jump-in attempts with far mk/cr.hp/cr.mk.

From what I’ve seen from playing ryus you need to be semi-psychic with the HSU for them to not block it or punish it with a SRK/FA. It’s not as psychic as a jump in since the HSU is faster, but it’s still pretty slow.

[Skatan_Milla]

From what I’ve seen from playing ryus you need to be semi-psychic with the HSU for them to not block it or punish it with a SRK/FA. It’s not as psychic as a jump in since the HSU is faster, but it’s still pretty slow.

A jump is 45 frames, HK Hazanshu is 26f so there’s a big difference there.
Hadoken is 13+45f, so so you have 32 frames to react to it with a HK hazanshu, which equals just above half a second.
While if you jump only have 13 to punish it with a jump which equals less than a quarter of a second.
So like I said, you can do it on reaction, but from experience it’s very diffifcult to be punishing every hadoken with it while also looking out for tatsus and jumps.
I can’t do it 100%, but the payoff is nice since you get 150dmg and +4 frame advantage.
You can also tag on the ex legs link on it for a total of 300 damage.

[c_nul]

I think the trouble with hazan shu is it’s look like (for me) a startup of a combo.

I don’t realize hazan shu hk is a good move alone so i always forgot to use it to punish fireball cause i cannot do anything after that.

Whereas a “simple” jump in lead to a massive combo.

Again i know i’m wrong but i think that’s the problem with hazan shu hk and perhaps it’s why a lot of chun li don’t threat Ryu with that.

And as you said Skatan Milla :

So basically if you do that effectivley Ryu needs to start getting his damage in through other ways than fireball setups and opens up an easier way for Chun to stay on the ground.

:tup:

I will train my hazan shu (150 dmg is nice, yes)

[Hoffburger]

A jump is 45 frames, HK Hazanshu is 26f so there’s a big difference there.
Hadoken is 13+45f, so so you have 32 frames to react to it with a HK hazanshu, which equals just above half a second.
While if you jump only have 13 to punish it with a jump which equals less than a quarter of a second.
So like I said, you can do it on reaction, but from experience it’s very diffifcult to be punishing every hadoken with it while also looking out for tatsus and jumps.
I can’t do it 100%, but the payoff is nice since you get 150dmg and +4 frame advantage.
You can also tag on the ex legs link on it for a total of 300 damage.

Yea but you are forgetting that you have to do the HCB motion and press a kick button which reduces the window for you to react to the fireball. It’s a great way to punish fireballs, but it isn’t a win button. Miss-timing it just by a split second can lead to a trade DP into ultra, DP into FADC ultra, or a FA into ultra. Also, at least from my experience, when you are in the range where they are still throwing fireballs and you can HSU over to hit them, odds are they are out of range after the HSU to follow up with anything. If they are throwing fireballs at you when you are close enough to follow up the HSU then you should just be stuffing the fireball with a poke anyways.

[Ikaru]

Yea but you are forgetting that you have to do the HCB motion and press a kick button which reduces the window for you to react to the fireball. It’s a great way to punish fireballs, but it isn’t a win button. Miss-timing it just by a split second can lead to a trade DP into ultra, DP into FADC ultra, or a FA into ultra. Also, at least from my experience, when you are in the range where they are still throwing fireballs and you can HSU over to hit them, odds are they are out of range after the HSU to follow up with anything. If they are throwing fireballs at you when you are close enough to follow up the HSU then you should just be stuffing the fireball with a poke anyways.

If that’s the case then the only real problem is leveling up your own personal execution. Yomi man, shotos got psychic DPs; chun can have psychic HSUs!

[Hoffburger]

If that’s the case then the only real problem is leveling up your own personal execution. Yomi man, shotos got psychic DPs; chun can have psychic HSUs!

Regardless of how good your execution is there is no way you can do the full HSU motion instantaneously, there will always be some sort of delay before you perform the attack. There will also be some lag from when you see the fireball coming to when you start doing the motion, it’s just human biology. Being psychic and expecting it helps.

Anyways, my point was just looking at the frame data doesn’t tell always tell you the whole story on if you can punish something on reaction. Also, just to clarify, I’m not saying you can’t punish fireballs on reaction with HSU, it’s just not as easy as people make it seem when quoting frame data.

[Darklightjg1]

You can buffer the motion without actually pressing the kick button. To add to that, you can start reacting the to movement the Ryu player does to buffer in a fireball (there’s always a quick crouch whether they fake it or not). If you see/hear the fireball, press kick. If not, then don’t and continue spacing.

Reacting to fireballs with hsu is not as high risk as you’re making it out to be.

[Hoffburger]

You can buffer the motion without actually pressing the kick button. To add to that, you can start reacting the to movement the Ryu player does to buffer in a fireball (there’s always a quick crouch whether they fake it or not). If you see/hear the fireball, press kick. If not, then don’t and continue spacing.

Reacting to fireballs with hsu is not as high risk as you’re making it out to be.

You also lose your charge if you do that, plus you’re being psychic and not reacting to the fireball, which is what I was saying you have to do in the first place. Being “semi-psychic” and thinking that they are going to throw the fireball and then reacting to it works really well.

The ryus and sagats that I play are very good at mixing up throwing fireballs, faking, and reacting to the HSU if I miss the timing or guess wrong and do it when they don’t throw the fireball.

I’ll say it again, using HSU to punish fireballs is good, just don’t think of it as an easy/free move vs. fireballs. If you barely miss the timing or get baited you are going to get punished HARD, whereas hitting them with the HSU is usually only going to end up in the 150 HSU damage for the reasons I posted earlier.

Just mix it up a bit, sometimes throw a HSU, sometimes throw a kikkoken, sometimes FA dash, sometimes block and take the chip if they like to throw a SRK/TK after their fireball expecting you to jump in, HSU, or FA.

[Skatan_Milla]

–
The ryus and sagats that I play are very good at mixing up throwing fireballs, faking, and reacting to the HSU if I miss the timing or guess wrong and do it when they don’t throw the fireball.

Just mix it up a bit, sometimes throw a HSU, sometimes throw a kikkoken, sometimes FA dash, sometimes block and take the chip if they like to throw a SRK/TK after their fireball expecting you to jump in, HSU, or FA.

I find it weird that you’re saying in one piece that they’re good at reacting to it, and in the second you’re saying that they’re guessing for it.
Which if they’re guessing for it puts them in the exact same spot you’re putting hazanshu.
You need to realize different people have different reaction skills, while you might not be able to punish hadokens with hazanshu there will be people who can, it is a long way from impossible.

Which is why I previously wrote:

I don’t know how it is for everyone else, but for me it’s possible to hk hazanshu over fireballs as guaranteed punish on reaction, but I have to be thinking about the fireball at that moment for me to react fast enough.

It is a tip that I know will work for some people, but I can’t be sure it will work for everyone.
In my case, it doesn’t require you to me to be psychic, and it doesn’t require me to pre-buffer hazanshu to have enough time to do it.
It can be used in many ways, but I find it the most useful in the beggining, during ranged play and during the end of a game.
If I’m up-close or mid range I won’t be able to react to the fireball unless it’s something like cr.mk xx hadoken so in that range it’s better to play by poking.
It’s also a strong tool if you have ultra and you’re trying to bait them into throwing a fireball, but they won’t throw one unless you lose your charge first, so if you sit and charge ultra and then dash, they will most likely throw a fireball after the dash, which opens up a chance for hk hazanshu, or in the case of Sagat ex hazanshu is safer due to the high tiger often catching hk hazanshu out of the air, it also deals more damage (200 instead of 150).

[Nevvermore]

Are we talking max range for hk hz here or closer? Because at max range I’d think most people would be able to react to a fireball, with a little practice.

[c_nul]

About the corner, i made a video on the late cross up in corner.

For the moment the only use i see is to bait reversal move since they will go always in the same way. Specially versus charge character cause they don’t want to move at wake up

That’s why i was thinking but i notice something else strange.

Sometimes i eat reversal Butt Drop of Honda or Anti Air Rolling of blanka in the wrong way.
They go towards the corner.

I manage to do this video and another with all the cast to understand how it’s works
[media=youtube]gECnxlMvXuo[/media]

I’m uploading the other right now.

If someone want discuss about that ^^

[Nevvermore]

btw Skatan, if you didn’t know, this Ryu-player you played against recorded some matches (around 12) against you. They’re on Youtube.