Chun Li General Thread: Blue Jade

Some things I know went wrong… the throw is the most common and the most irritating - why her throw range is now garbage.

Anti air also seems terrible, I would be like, this is ridiculous, people jumping in stuffing back + hk, st mp, st mk, nothing would work for anti air it seemed.

Her hachanzu wannabe thing got stuffed every time I tried it.

Her jump v skill thing got stuffed or punished almost every time I tried it.

My own fault but seems like any time I needed to poke someone, I was holding back and got some shit move, missed the damage, and got whiff punished.

Besides this I got destroyed for a lot of fireballs, startup so slow and speed is crap. Even ex version is so slow.

This thing with holding back making her do close moves I find unfair for her charge fb.

Seemed like v trigger got me nothing as I was near death getting it at all and didn’t make much difference since footsies seem useless without range or seeming like she can combo to convert to anything. Also seems like trying to do her combos is a big risk, like trying to get st lk into legs after back + hp I’d miss consistently and be swept.

I hate command legs btw.

Her crossup seems crappy, like it is as bad as mk crossup in 4 which is to say garbage.

Her jump forward lk seems crap (maybe decent as air to air, but I liked using it in 4 as it was like jump forward mk in 2 which really worked for me), jump forward mk in this seems clunky. Like I couldn’t combo it into anything with range so you have to jump in all close - the animation makes it look like you’re hitting them on the head with the inside of her knee. That is a big part of what I don’t like, she feels clunky to me, like omega chun in 4. Similarly, why you can combo cr hp as easily into hard birdkick as lk version seems like the game has all the balance of omega, which is to say none.

So basically by the end I was going into matches like this character is garbage, I have nothing, no damage, no range, no antiair, no poke game, and no throw. Defense didn’t really get me very far. Without a gameplan or any confidence, even when things went more my way, I lost by a little rather than a lot.

I’m not interested in playing other characters, so if that’s chun in this, I’m not interested in playing the game period. I am pissed as I did enjoy street fighter 4, and with the game going where it seems to be in 5, I’ll miss playing. Also I feel like why bother playing 4 if this is where it’s going and everyone is going to be playing this.

Seems like you’re using the wrong buttons and pressing them at the wrong time. Your main AAs should be b+hk, b+hp, s.lk and c.hk in limited cases. Here strengths come from whiff punishing, so you see a shoto whiff sweep or c.mk? You should immediately hit s.hp. Also you should be Kara throwing with her instead of regular throw. There’s no reason not to. What you should learn to do is whiff punish effectively, confirm supers off of counterhits and set up her frame trap/throw mix up game. She shouldn’t play that differently from sf4 since she was one of the few characters who could play a traditional SF playstyle effectively.

inb4 500pp Chun.

She has great AAs, though.

It really just seems like you haven’t gotten enough to time to adjust. I was winning tons of matches on footsies alone.

You can walk behind a lp fireball. If they try to jump in on you, use b.HK. If they stay on the ground to block the fireball, try df.MK.

Pressure them with V-Trigger. If they get nervous and jump, that’s a free b.HK into sweep for 6 hits and some decent damage. cr.MK hits twice in VT and is easier to hit confirm. You can also go for the same fireball setup in VT and get a combo off of df.MK if it hits.

Seems like you need more than a two day stress test to adjust. Even a 5 day beta won’t do much. It’s just a beta after all anyway. You’ll get there eventually.

Btw if anyone is having trouble against Nash’s “jaguar kick”, s.lk beats it or trades depending on your timing.

What annoys me is that they said SF5 would have everyone be at the top of their game, so that they wouldnt have to nerf anybody. But this clearly isn’t Chun at the top of her game, and that’s the problem

Chun at the top of her game is 3S. Giving you complete 3S Chun with normals as good as they were back then, in a game with no parry (outside of Ryu) is just ASKING for trouble. Especially when you add in those absurd normals with V-Trigger online.

Hey WildDog I’ll just address each issue with a bullet: (This will be a lot but please read on. I want you to be successful and have fun!)

*Gootecks has an excellent breakdown of throw range on one his videos. Basically if you imagine Ryu v Ryu, You’ll want your forward foot’s heel to be touching the opponent’s heel to be in throw range. Setting this up is easy enough with a Cr. Lp to step and throw. I did get some oddity throw whiffs too however mostly against Nash.

*B+Hk and St. Hp, F+Mp were the best Anti Air buttons I used. Cr. Hp and Cr. Mp both work like they did in SF4. It is difficult to train A/As in the beta since we can’t record but setting the opponent to neutral jump for a few minutes should establish your timing required for each button. Take it from a long LONG time Chun player, especially in SF4, sometimes the best option is to not Anti Air but just block. Also NEVER forget EX SBK. I never had it get beat out yet in SF5. Plus the addition of J. Mp xx LLegs is a great Air to Air option. Use Ryu J. MP xx Tatsu timing and you’ve got it!

*D/F Mk Overhead is garbage. I hate it myself. Good for a pinch if they are going D/B all day but outside VTrigger - I myself didn’t use it at all.

*VS takes a lot of practice to get the hang of timing and ranges off attacks. I think the main problem you had with it is ill-timed useage. For example. Say you throw a LP Kikouken, dash up and Cr. Hk. Maybe they block the Kikouken but get sweeped instead. Next time they’ll expect the sweep. Throw kikouken (they’ll block crouching) VS into J HP which is a twice hitting overhead. If they manage to block it you are in perfect range to throw them. These are just few things that opened up VS for me personally and led to some crazy Stun options.

*Part of learning a new game is unlearning what you’ve learned (aka habits) So instead of doing combos and such in training mode inbetween matches I messed around with all her buttons for that very reason. Understand the max range of all her normal buttons as well as command normals and literally attack the ‘dummy’ from one end to the other just jabbing in and out of range until it becomes imbedded in your mind. Counterhits and getting counterhit will happen, but if you put in the time that A LOT of players DO NOT do your success rate of landing attacks will increase. Then you start incorporating the special cancels. This is especially important with VTrigger-Chun, because the timing on her moves a bit different with everything hitting multiple times. I’m also not quite clear are the St. Lk LLegs after B+HP part - I’d venture to say not to use St. Lk really at all. If you are in range for St. Lk you’ll be in range for Cr. Mk xx HK LLegs (max range you are safe from punish, for now at least). B+Hp is semi-situational and starting out only advise using it on deep jump in or corner setups. I feel Chun has better tools for mid-screen tactics.

*In SF4 J. MK would primarily be used during Safe Jump setups even then J .HP was the better option for Cr. HK OS, U2 etc., and provided a better cross up that was hard to distinguish leading to easy Cr. Hp xx LLegs pressure. In SF5 you really need to hit J. Mk deep, basically her Knee hitting the opponent’s back shoulder/Mid Bicep. With all that said if you want to cross up - use D/F Hk. I found that classic SF4 Vanilla safe jump knockdown D/F Hk cross up is safe on reversal DP’s MWAHAHAAH sorry Ryu player I remember your death on that and my laughter of “OMG it works!” Any way. Stay grounded and focused on ground control with Chun-Li, no need to jump around. She’ll control the skies pretty easily once you nail your anti-airs.

I think that about covers it.
I truly wish there was a way I could play with you and help you out.
However the basic game plan is always push the opponent to the corner. You have to think about what buttons and situations will allow you to do this most effectively. Playing Ryu will help a lot and I’d suggest it. I know he’s F*%#@ Ryu and he’s lame and stupid F’ that scrub character BUT he has all the tools to be successful… Once you establish a solid game plan around his fundamentals go back to Chun-Li with the same mindset.
Nearly ALL of my fights the very first thing I did was step forward. I’m instantly challenging my opponent!

Hope it helps man, besides this is a Beta. No need to get worried over it. Tomorrow starts the 5 day phase 1. Excellent chance to play Ryu for 2 days. Don’t even touch Chun. Then the last three days, pick her.

Right now I think Birdie is her toughest match up. Everyone else she can deal with one way or another with smart and methodical play.

I dont think ive used chuns light kick once in the last week. And light punch has only been used a handful of times, almost always when linking light legs into each other. I love no longer relying on lights for everything. Mediums just feel so much better.

Thanks for the breakdown, Rayartz.

It’s interesting that I found the Birdies to be the easiest, I guess because being a grappler you wouldn’t use footsies or rely on throw against them. Though his ability to get through fb’s at such long range is troubling. v skill seemed to work well on him with his size and they’re never blocking.

I had some issues adjusting to jump hp air to airs - it will sometimes hit once, sometimes twice I noticed, but you only ever need 1 button press I think. If it hits once you can do a meterless 3xstomps after, but if it hits twice I think only ex sbk can follow? - too many times I ate big damage as my stomps went right through and I landed on their wu sweep or throw. That was my favorite aa in 4 so I’m bummed about that. Really bummed you can’t get wall jump after stomps.

Seriously scarred about the throws whiffing, often it would seem like I was right on top of them and still wouldn’t work - my favorite anti air is to walk under and throw. I think that wasn’t working at all.

So many things, it’s like I would know what they were gonna do, but it didn’t matter. Read after read unrewarded gets irritating.

I do find her button timing irritating. Like I said before, I find Ryu so easy in this. Like everything just works, where with Chun it just doesn’t. I’d like figured out all his combos that were in the online videos I googled in like an hour. Chun’s on the other hand, I only watched this 1 combo video, but hurt me more than helped. Like with Ryu I’m easily doing jump in hk, st mp, st hp, st hk or like the one where he jumps in, st mp, v trigger, ex tatsu, ex srk - shit is so easy and just mash it out. Chun’s combo vid is like jump in mk, st hp, and then this hard link to st lk then legs. Much easier to skip the lk and just do legs…

I did go back to Ryu yesterday. It’s really easy I think. Fireballs are so safe and fast to start up. Once you get denjin mode it’s ridiculously good. cr mk to fb, so easy. dp jump ins, so easy. Also blowing up people hitting buttons or throw attempts, I’ll be mashing dp. Tatsus out of the corner and as frame traps, seems about like it was in 4. Not that I’m like good or anything with him, but I’ve won more than lost with him by like 4 to 1 in this game. Boring as shit though, I don’t want to be a Ryu player; Chun has always been my favorite to play, the walk speed and st fierce and stomps actually get me off.

You know I’m gonna have to try this again, but god damn, it’s discouraging so far.

I like the way Chun feels in this way more than sf4, feels more like 3rd strike chun which is great.

Her v-skill seems completely useless though, too slow for movement and I haven’t had much luck using it to go over fireballs either.

Outside of v-trigger she doesn’t really seem to have anything to deal with projectiles besides jumping over them, if her kikoken was motion it’d be easier, or b-hp worked on them outside of v-trigger, or v-skill was projectile invincible, just my thoughts.

My impressions from NA beta:

BnBs.
cr.lk, cr.lp, st.mp xx hk/ex legs
jump in attack, cr.lp, st.mp, cr.mk xx hk/ex legs

If no lights to medium attacks, then:
cr.lk. cr.lp, st.lp xx mk/ex legs
jump in, st.mp, cr.mk xx mk/ex legs.

Reason why I use these so much is that they are true blockstrings during your confirm. And if you see a block, you can switch up between walk up st.mp to fish for a counter hit, and go into cr.mk xx legs; cr.mk xx fireball confirm to super; throw; or just block. However, if kara throws are being taken out, throw is a weaker option for sure.

I’ve had great success playing the walk in and out of low forward/sweep range and poking with f.mp.

Like many, I’m having a hard time having both hits of j.hp connect. So I just opt for j.hk.

Best anti-airs are b.hk for close, and st.lk for everything else. Tried cr.mp (slide), I would eat jump ins all day. Had mixed success with v skill as an anti-air. There’s no real invincibility on it. You can definitely react to Nash jag kicks, Cammy divekicks, and Bison headstomps and get them clean with b.hk, it’s that good.

st.mk is good against lows, but outright loses to cr.mp from Ryu and Bison. I prefer f.mp since it’s faster and longer reach, despite being unable to go over lows.

Against fireball spam, I just neutral jump and air lightning legs accordingly. Against Ryu V trigger, just cr.mp (slide) under fireballs, reacting to the release of the fireball.

V trigger is so good, but I honestly never get a chance to use it unless I get hit a lot. It’s impossible to build v gauge on v skill alone.

Stand out normals for me are b.hk, st.mp (easy and leads to conversions), and f.mp.

Changes I personally would like to see are giving her v skill some sort of anti-air properties (invincibility or better hitbox/hurtbox). take out b.mp command normal so she can retain charge during st.mp (or just changing her fireball to a motion instead). That’s pretty much it. In her current state, I believe she has the best anti-air normals in the game, and some of the best pokes. She overall feels like a poke intensive character as opposed to a combo heavy one.

I think Chun’s V-skill is currently misunderstood. I feel like there could be some pretty good use for it - that being said at a high level i can imagine it being kinda useless unless its used offensively. How does it work as an A/A? haven’t really got to try that much.

I tried using it as an AA a few times but just got beat out every time by the other guys attack, I also don’t like that if you do land it you have to use EX legs after stomps because normal air legs won’t connect for some reason. I just feel her normal buttons work better right now, as she actually has good anti air normals now, especially in v-trigger where you can get followups from them.

I also don’t really like her slide at all right now, the window for going under fireballs is so small,it recovers really slow, and its unsafe on hit, why?

When I tried anti-airing it varied. Sometimes I would get a hit, but I suspect they didn’t throw out an attack mid air. Other times I would get stuffed by things like Cammy’s divekick.

From Capcom’s explanation of her v skill, it’s supposed to be an alternative jump, since her default jump is so floaty, but honestly, the opponent has ample time to react to it. All it does is shoots you into the air where you hang for a while. I would rather take a divekick than have the v skill. Besides, you can sort of cut your default jump short by doing legs asap, possibly baiting out dps or what not.

edit: Thinking about it some more, you can confirm into v skill off j.hp. Problem is it’s hard to land both j.hp hits for some reason, even on a stunned standing character. And anyone with reactions will always block the first hit of j.hp, not giving you enough time to confirm into v skill.

Her f.MP is good for stuffing Nash projectiles if you guys are struggling in that matchup, just use her fireball to slowly inch forward to get in and you can snack him during startup. B.hp/st.lk/b.HK can all beat his jaguar kicks off he’s getting too predictable with them. Oddly enough, I feel that his normals are actually what gives her the most trouble (especially sweep since it seems pretty safe if they space it and has godly range). Just try to inch forward and whiff punish when you can, until you’re close enough to stay mixups which is where he falls apart. If you do get b.HP may enough on his wakeup, you can actually punish his air teleport with St.lk/b.HP/f.MP if you react quick enough.

My reasoning for making v skill a legit anti air is as follows.

By landing a v skill anti air, you build up v gauge. In turn you will get v trigger much sooner which powers up your poke and confirm game a lot. This sort of mechanic rewards proper anti airing, by powering up your ground based game.

Maybe they’re not doing it this way because it seems like it’ll make Chun some sort of offensive wall of anti-airs and pokes, making her a little too turtle-y than they’d want her to be.

I mean, I have absolutely no say in this matter, as I don’t know how to balance games at all. But the state of her v skill/trigger right now is that it’s simply a comeback mechanic. Whereas other characters can build v gauge in response to the opponent’s offense or on their own terms.

It being an alternative jump would be good but you can’t even act out of it until you reach a certain height, makes it way easier for the opponent to react to. It also starts up way slower than a normal jump.

WildDog:

You’re correct J. Hp is a single button press now to get both hits. Kinda wonky because we are all used to controlling the hits.
But here is how it works in SF5. You hit it early for two hits, hit it late (like around the face) and you get a single hit.
Same thing for Air to Air. If they are aerial and you meet them with J. Hp a single hit will come out, unless you are already in the air
I can’t speak for stomps in this game outside of Vskill juggles but I went for EX SBK multiple times. I think the damage was around 320, so that is pretty strong for a air to air punish. Plus J. Mp addition again you can cancel ALegs and even hit them with a Critical Art when you land.

As for BNBs check out this video by kmpyj1

Some aren’t optimized but they lay a good ground work.

As for Birdie, Chun’s biggest issue with him is his ability to poke and outrange her with 1050 health. That is 150 more health points than Chun, plus he hits a lot harder than Chun. So she can’t afford to make 2 mistakes, 1 she’ll bleed, 2 she’s killed.
They really need to give her 950 Health at least. I mean Capcom…didn’t you learn from USF4? You said you did - you buffed her health right? That’s what I remember…anyway

You always have to bring the most damage/stun for the situation. That is why I only used like 4 combos when playing.
For example, which is better Cr. Hp xx HK LLegs or Cr. HP (x2) xx EX LLegs. The answer is obvious and for 1 bar; my notes aren’t near me right now but it is like 100 + extra points of stun. That can be all the difference in the world.

BTW Turtle Chun?
Never heard of her. My SF4 Chun is rush down and aggressive. So I like SF5 Chun a lot - she does rush down and aggressive quite well.