That if you move the stick left and right in the air the character will float in that direction. Insane isn’t it?
Wow your a dumb fuck. No, it doesn’t add depth. Adding depth means it adds another choice, it doesn’t add any choice, its a necessary landing button. There is never a reason NOT to L cancel. Its only an entry barrier. It doesn’t cut down your landing lag, it sets a NEW landing lag base. It only adds to the technical difficulty and the entry barrier, and is one of the worst things ever created in design history. It showcases how the Smash makers don’t understand fighting games at all. If you don’t L cancel, you aren’t at an advantage, ever. That’s not depth.
Also, fuck Overswarm for holding out on this technique. Someone get on his ass and rag him out about it. Jesus christ what an ass whole. He’s lost all respect in my book by doing this.
Yeah, it is an entry barrier. It’s also quite satisfying when you finally master it.
I dislike entry barries that add nothing to the game. Its fine when they actually do something, but just putting up a wall is silly. In Guilty Gear XX, NONE of the entry barriers are useless, they all provide and add depth to the game. L canceling doesn’t do anything to the game. You could take it out, put everyones landing lag at that spot, and the game would still play exactly the same. You can’t say that about a single one of guilty gear’s entry barriers.
Are you CRASHiC on Smashboards by any chance? The Eureka 7 similarities and your stance on L-Canceling are too similar.
No entry barriers in guilty gear? What about difficult to preform combos? They could make the combo chains 1 button, because once you hit the first move there’s no reason not to do the combo. Why not make the combo happen automatically?
Because execution is part of the game. L-canceling is the same way, it’s something that sets players with decent to good execution apart from players with bad execution.
Read it again. He said nothing about Guilty Gear not having entry barriers. Guilty Gear does not have USELESS entry barriers.
Why is L-canceling less useless than making you perform a combo?
I hate to say this; I really do. You’re completely missing the point.
No one’s saying L Canceling is useless. The problem with it is that, unlike teching and wavedashing for example, there is never a reason to not L-Cancel. It’d be one thing if there was ever a time that where doing it would be disadvantageous.
There’s never a time when doing a combo after the first hit is disadvantageous.
I didn’t mean the technique was useless, I’m just saying according to his argument it’s pointless to make you l-cancel.
In Melee, there really is no disadvantage from doing a combo save for damage scaling, but that’s debateable on how big of a deal that is.
Anyway, in Guilty Gear, BlazBlue, and TvC, there’s the universal combo breaker move which I’ll just call Burst Attack. If the opponent has the conditions met to do it, there is a situation where you don’t want to combo. Heck, you can even bait the opponent into doing the attack. If SSB had something like this then maybe I’d be more accepting of L-Canceling. Still, I would prefer to see canceling used more as within the traditional methods such as IASA frames.
w/e man, it’s just a dumb analogy I’m making. There’s a ton of ways to break it down >.<
My point was that it’s just a part of execution. It’s fun (at least for me) to have a trick like that to practice and master, and it feels good when you are able to pull it off consistently. I honestly wouldn’t mind that much if it wasn’t in there, I’m just saying that it has its merits.
I’m just curious about this new thing they’re talking about discovering, but these guys are being assholes for telling people they have it and hiding how to do it. If they’re gonna save it for a tourney, fine, save it. But why the fuck are they doing this? lol
I probably will still dislike brawl anyways.
TL;DR smash is dead and will never be a real/competitive fight game legitimized by a community of players with a maturity level to realize that Nintendo doesn’t give a frack about making a game competitive as long as they make a buck. And by a buck I mean a huge ass buck.
You NEVER want to L-cancel when you are edge canceling. I screwed up plenty of perfectly good edge cancels by trying to L-cancel them.
One thing I don’t understand are statements like “Nintendo doesn’t know how to make a fighting game”. Smash Brothers isn’t primarily a fighting game. A genre is a way to group games so people can pick out titles that appeal to them.
When someone plays fighting games, they are expecting it to be a certain way. Mortal Kombat, Street Fighter, King of Fighters they all have similarities. There is a certain system that all those games have where you can actually recognize it as a fighter. Smash doesn’t have anything like that, it’s merely labeled a fighting game because there is violence and there is a community who feels insecure playing a party game competitively.
Also, L Canceling is unnecessary as well as the huge amount of lag after doing aerials with out the technique. Doing more complex stuff doesn’t really mean that the game is more in-depth.
Being someone who played Melee competitively for years, and went from not knowing anything about advanced techniques to going into tournaments with them all mastered, I can tell you this. If you really believe that L-Canceling didn’t add depth to the game, then you’re likely bitter because you probably never learned it. It took practice to learn correctly. You can argue that it’s pointless to have in this game, but if you never played Melee and are a Brawl player, then you have no understanding of the concepts regarding it. L-Canceling becomes like FADC a shoryuken with RYU into his Ultra if you have a meter. Is there a moment that you shouldn’t do it if you catch the shoryuken? No. It adds depth to the game. Your argument is flawed.
Melee is, without a doubt, the deepest fighting game ever made. I’ve played countless other fighting games, Brawl was a complete disappointment that broke the heart of thousands of Melee players. Brawl+ is much better, but it’s still no Melee. Saying something is going to be revealed for Brawl doesn’t mean anything. The physics are still slow.
Look at this combo video.
[media=youtube]44CRrJVhUIo[/media]
Fox will never, in brawl, be that fast. Ever.
L-Canceling aside, that’s only one of the countless techniques to learn. Wavedashing was another amazing technique that added even more depth, it introduced Waveshining, and whole new set of combos. Edge-Teching, Jump-Canceled grabbing, SHFFLC, and more. Melee is incredibly deep and required years of play to master. It required technical skill. Something Brawl doesn’t have. Brawl only has mindgames, but guess what? Melee had that too, and you could respond to the other person in a third of the time you have in Brawl. Made you think much faster.
Now you can’t say, I’m bad at Brawl and I’m just pissed. In fact, anyone who was good at Melee. Will be good at Brawl. Look at M2K. He’s top in brawl now, though with Metaknight, but he was an incredible fox player. In the first few months Brawl was out I was ranked 3rd In MLG’s online ranking. Only Diesuperfly and another were above me. “Smash in General” isn’t competitive? If you really believed that you never played Melee. Melee was the biggest game at any MLG. It attracted huge crowds. Even MTV made a true life on it. It’s all an ignorant defense for Brawl. Brawl+ needs to be made the standard.
I made an account just to reply to this foolishness.
I hope you’ll continue using your account.
There’s a difference between L-Cancenling and FADC. FADC comes at a cost - half of your super meter. L-Canceling did not come at a cost, only a benefit (unless you count that edge canceling example and some specific Pikachu examples). You can’t always FADC into Ultra either because you don’t have the Ultra or you don’t have enough meter.
I’m not arguing they there is not any skill involved in executing L-Canceling nor that there is a reward, but couldn’t it have been done some other way?
Adding depth means adding viable options. As I’ve mentioned before, teching has depth because there are four possible outcomes behind it, DI has a myriad of possible outcomes, in (S)SFIV, there are three possible outcomes for FADC. L-Canceling has only one outcome - cutting recovery in half and nothing else with no cost whatsoever for doing it (aside from the aforementioned examples).
Can’t argue with this really, maybe not on Melee’s depth though.
Look at what wavedashing brought about, and then look at what L-Canceling brought about. This part of your post sums up the problems with L-Canceling.
Melee will always be better than Brawl ever could be, the only reason anyone is talking about Brawl now is because of it being “shiny” and new and a ton of new players have flooded in to play it.
Trust me, give it another 2-3 years and Melee will be on top once again with new talent and players, annoyed to death with Brawl, fueling the already amazing Melee scene.
I don’t mean to troll, but how do you feel about Virtua Fighter? Just curious.
(FYI, I play melee too)
Overswarm was lying, this thread is pointless.
good day