hmm, other than the sheer annhilation that occurs against 90% of the matches when ppl pick these characters cause of assymetrical character awareness and xp, i found myself having trouble with adon’s off the wall kick (armor breaks, could not AA with s.rh). i’m still neutral on guy, but his 4-frame reversal tatsu hurts and the rh version crosses over you on the arc up which screws up the charge for the standard c.strong, rh sk punish. also not sure if he can be safe jumped bc of the 4 frame reversal. focus is iffy against him too bc of safe shoulder, demon flip grab (heinous dmg), and one of his slides sometimes causes the focus hit box, especially for characters with high hitboxes like bison, to whiff. i’ve only played one competent juri who figured out the feng shui combo/mixup/reset who was pretty good. watch for the ex pinwheel, you get c.strong, rh scissor punish on block. she has great pressure from her s.lk 3/4 frame execution close/far, +3/+6, +3/+7 block hit advs respectively so she’s very strong on the ground at the range of her s.lk. between her and hawk, their command options to command dive after jump gives me AA problems cause the dives > s.rh. so when i see them jump, i try to put them on dive or normal jump immediately and j.strong for dive, and just s.rh for normal. i play against makoto kind of like abel (keepaway)l, except she’s less mobile and seems to have horrendous AA so i jump for free when i get the chance. also after her command grab, dash punch, it seems like you can backdash out of any mixup she attempts afterwards except for maybe another dash punch.
in general, it seems like you can safe jump all of them, but crossing up is dangerous against dj and guy cause their wakeup reversals autocorrect or have wide horizontal hitboxes that hit the cross.
I think when Valle was giving the Adon tutorial on fight nights, he said the Rising Jaguar has no invincible frames. So apparently you’re able to throw Adon if he tries to do Rising Jaguar after a blocked Jaguar Tooth. It’s -4/-1/-2/-2 on block.
God i hate been disconnected while im typing and it deletes the entire message. T_T
So for a second time,
Is there anyone that thinks like me about the fact that ultra 1 is way better than ultra 2?
I mean… Ultra 1 can anti-air if triggered well, ultra 1 can combo into j. mpx3… ultra 2 can combo with j. mpx2 only.
If you are a cheap victory player… ultra 1 is way better than the ultra 2.
Ultra 1 does close to 100 more damage than ultra 2.
Yea i know that ultra 2 is very good to punish fireballs from everywhere on the screen… but like som1 said sooner… good ppl will avoid to fireball if ur ultra is ready!
Also the Ultra 1 can punish fireballs if you trap the opponent to fireball enough close. (You know the c.lp > c.lp > c.mk > fireball from most of shotos combo… well if its a block string, you can trigger the ultra between the c.mk and fireball… which is pretty nasty! )
Finaly, the ultra 2 was pretty cool at release because most of the opponents didnt know about the cross over thing or just didn’t even know how to block it… but now, its pretty rare that som1 will get caught from a random trigger and will punish right away… or even in the air!
Soooo thats why i think ultra 2 is better than ultra 1… IF there is hidden thing super cool about the ultra 2 that i forgot or didn’t realize yet… tell me! I’m pretty sad still having to use the old ultra 1. T_T
You said it yourself… People will avoid fireball if your ultra2 is ready.
You limit their options, you shut their game down. This is the value of U2, and this is why you should take it.
You should not aim specifically to use U2, but to make your opponent realise you can.
(btw, AA with U1 and link breaking with it have always proved difficult to me, but whatever.)
His LK Rising Jaguar can be thrown, as to my knowledge it has no invincible frames. MK, HK, and EX Rising Jaguar **DO **have invincibile frames, however they are very short.
I got a chance to play several matches against a very solid Cody and determined that you really need to win that match on footsies. Punishing his specials is just too tight on the timing if you’re playing a smart player that never does anything but LP Criminal Upper to end block strings. I also got hit by this move where he throws dirt quite a bit on his wakeup, it was even working as cross up protection.
You cannot PP full screen rocks even if you predict it, I was buffering one match and just took a wild guess and did the ultra and during the pause you could see Cody still in the startup frames on the rock throw, yet he recovered quickly enough to block. I imagine this would work from anywhere closer than full screen though.
As for Makoto, I discovered there is literally nothing she can do about official Bison pressure.
Did he actually throw a rock, or did he do his fake throw? I have never even tried to full screen punish Cody with it but I have been able to punish thrown rocks from closer distances.
I have punished his rock throw across screen before, but the guy playing Cody was stupid enough to do it before wake up, and charged the attack too. I had way more than enough time to react, but if it is his fake rock throw, then yeah, he’ll recover long before you get a shot.
His normal Rock Throw is the same deal as Guile as well. If the ultra flash goes off after the rock leaves his hand, you’re not going to connect unless the player is taking a nap. You can at least save yourself a punish by holding back to avoid landing near him. When I’ve gotten tricked by a fake rock throw I’ve done this to avoid the punish opportunity.
I believe EX Rock Throw does have long recovery and is easier to punish, but among myself and those that I play with the only time I really see an EX Rock Throw is fucking up the input on U1 after an FADC
Not relevant to the matchup, but since I’m just seeing some back and forth ultra discussion, if the match is close and you’re in the corner without any EX moves available, U2 can be used as an escape to get the hell out of the corner and a chance to find your bearing. Obviously U1 can be done in a similar manner, but since U2 is not charge dependent it’s a little better as a desperation escape. This can also maybe have the effect of the person you’re playing maybe getting a little overconfident since they think you just threw out a random ultra, and not that there was a practical reason to whiffing your ultra.
Okay so there’s confirmation! But if she isn’t using Uc2, it’s a good choice against her IMO. And most Cammy players are definitely not using it online. You may see counter picks using Uc2 at tournaments though.
Considering how bad her U2 is its probably unlikely your going to see it at anything serious. Sure its nice when it hits but if it doesn’t the recovery is so long you have time to make a sammich and still rip her in half. It is defiantly an all or nothing deal, best used as a crossup deterrent.
U1 against Blanka? PP punishes all that U1 can punish plus horizontal balls and ambiguous Blanka U1 (You lose charge if blocked, IIRC).
Any other reason why’d U1 be preferable? I mean, other than better damage I guess. PP being able to shut down any of blanka’s balls (really hate saying this) is too big of a deal to ignore, I think.
Well I play the Blanka match up pretty lame. It’s all just pokes and ball punishes. They can get in through random slide knockdowns and rainbow cross ups or just plain rushing Bison down. I think those are the best opportunities to drop the Uc1 on them. It’s also a factor that Uc1 starts up half as fast as Uc2.
Yeah ignore the existence of Cammy U2 for all practical purposes. A Cammy I run into online alot had been using that, and after he guessed wrong throwing it out I proceeded to unleash a 50% damage combo with Guy on them. Since that point I’ve never seen them use it so it’s safe to say they got the memo.
Against Bison it’s maybe a little more practical given how many block strings Bison is likely to be throwing, but at that point they’re basically just praying for a mistimed link, assuming they mash it out during your strings.
well from what i’ve learned with a match using Makoto against laudanum09’s Bison is that Dictator can almost easily pressure her into a corner with SK pressure and block strings since she doesn’t have a reliable meterless reversal. And even her metered reversal with invincibility frames, EX Chop, is not very good. However there are some things you may need to look out for, especially when people begin to consistently pull off some of her tools:
Makoto can kara alot of her moves. Both normal and EX Karakusas (command throws) normally have very little range (EX Karakusa i think has even less range than her h.k karakusa), but by kara’ing it (f.LK ~ HCB+K), she can extend it to about 1/2 - 2/3 a person away. She can kara-Karakusa, kara-Hayate (qcf+LK~P), Kara-throw (f+LK~LP / 200 stun), and even Kara-Ultra I (I don’t remember the command for that). She has a couple of good target combos, her st.lk ~st.mk is alot like Sagat’s double hitting kicks and her f.mk ~ st.hk is I think a safer way of getting within range than her hayate. Her st.mp is probably one of her best normals for it’s speed and range. Although her AA isn’t so hot, if Makoto manages to beat you to a jumping normal, she can dash underneath you while you’re coming back down and start some shenanigans via karakusa as soon as you land. Also beware of jumping in on her if she’s has Ultra II. Although it doesn’t do the full animation, she can still do her post-ultra juggles or start some shenanigans. If you block the initial dive kick for Ultra II, she she still continues her combo but it’s very much punishable. She cannot jump cancel the end of her ultra if blocked.
That being said and done, she could only do these things to you if you let her. :wgrin:
can anyone shed some light on the zangief matchup? his jumping fk still stuffs my standing HK and cr. FP is pretty much useless against gief. gief rush me down 4 free.
People will avoid fireball if your ultra2 is ready.