yun in AE2012 is barely the same as ultra in terms of “I HATE THIS MU” so yeah for me its not anything new
I like hp kikoken more and more. Very useful at close range ^^
My training mode time suggests jump back HK as a good anti-air for Yun/Yang at footsie range, but I never remember to use it in a match.
@chutney-li
About Viper
I don’t have a good advice but i remember that ultra 1 can punish a whiffed burning kick though every chun li play U2 versus her xD.
The resaon swhy Viper would try to whiff an air burning kick is if you whow her that you can cr mk them on reaction.
Something i just notice is when she do a seismo, she extend a lot her legs hurtbox just before she hit the ground with her punch. She extend enough to make me notice that
So when you poke her, try to hit low first at max range if you want to counter hit her seismo because you will hit her leg
I think if the game is “right”, viper should have a weakness when she try to do a close seismo in order to hit you. If you manage well your spacing i’m sure it’s possible to footsies viper’s seismo attempts and scare her to seismo for free
The reason why i love HP kikoken is because the startup hitboxes of the moves can make whiff a lot of low moves.
I also suspecting hp kikoken is perhaps her “best poke” because all her good poke like stand mp , far hk and far hp lose to low move.
Any good player know this weakness of chun li moves. Look Zangief or any grappler in the game, they fish for a far hk with any crouch attack
So if you mixup hp kikoken in footsies when you opponent expect an other moves, you can maybe punish their moves or at least annoy them.
If i have time, i will check with more details her hitboxes during hp kikoken
Can someone help me out? I have never been able to fight deejay, I know how sad that is, don’t remind me. I just don’t get this matchup, what’s good against him? He pokes the fuck out of me and he seems to have stupid hurtboxes on all of his moves. I’m trying to avoid FA in this match because he can easily break it. I just don’t know how to get in and apply pressure. Do I poke him out? HALP please.
good to read you cnul, good shit.
It’s like the Guile matchup. Push him to the corner, don’t get AA’d, don’t let him out of the corner. You can reaction U1 his sonic booms a la Ryu’s hadokens as well. No need to jump unless it’s a setup to bait out his EX flash kicks. Just walk him to the corner, you have better normals/buttons in general.
Also, OS setups.
You could use U2 too like what I did a while ago, but I really recommend U1 cause it shuts down a lot of his stuff. I believe U1 punishes his b,f+k forward kicks and U1 on block, for example.
some more
L, but given that it’s Evo, hopefully more insight to the match.
Don’t be embarrassed about it, she’s not one of the characters who blew him up for free, it was pretty even pre-Ultra. I used to play a couple of different “okay” Dee Jays, and I never felt the match was anything but 5-5. I’m not expecting to play many in Ultra though.
In 2012 I would try to bulldog him to the corner. His buttons are a bit laggy, and his double hit rolling sobats can be punished, with U1 and possibly with sweep? I can’t remember. His quick jump knee thing can be low profiled with cr mk or cr mp. His fireball has fairly fast recovery, so I find it hard to actually punish with Hasan Shu, thus I don’t really use it in the match, however it’s definitely Ultra 1 bait. If you did a proper meaty jab it would stuff or allow you to block every wakeup move he had (block Ultra & ex hands, stuff everything else), but his wakeup works differently now, you might want to use crouching short for the active frames.
But yeah, I general I would do lots of blocking and lots of cr lp, and try to remember to not use anything lk sobat would go over with it’s low invul.
The changes mean that he can be bullied with cr.lk, and his lk sobat is safer, and can now only be punished with super It was already pretty safe against Chun though, reversal ex legs was the only other option, and it was pretty hard.
Also, jumping isn’t great even if he doesn’t have charge, if he does has charge, don’t even bother. Don’t try to cross him up or do any type of safe jump except a perfectly timed anti-4 framer.
Thank you 4neqs and robotic elf, I can definitely do a few things differently. I don’t think I apply enough pressure on his wake up. I’ll have to test everything out. 
Poison’s Aeolus Edge projectile is kind of a pain to deal with when you don’t have ultra (especially online where even hasanshu is hard to use against it), but I noticed the startup is slow (with HP having the slowest startup at 23f), so you can stuff it more easily than most other fireballs or even just trade in your favor. Fierce punch around the mid-range is pretty good for this. Roundhouse from even ever is slower but can still catch them with a trade. Sweep is probably the best trade because you can finally get in and do some work.
Haven’t really been that bothered by the other stuff she can do (more bothered by her stupid hurtboxes than her actual abilities).
All rekka’s except the 1st hit of EX can be reversal EX Legs’d on block.
Throw -> dash -> half step -> j. lk will cross up can bait her DPs for free.
Her Love Me tender move pretty much functions like an EX HSU when it comes to projectiles, so be careful with those. It’s safe on block and she has a DP that you have to worry about after blocking it, so it’s a free mixup on block. You can beat it before it gets to you with cl. HK if you’re looking for it.
Backflip invincibility lasts ridiculously long (33 frames!) and you have to wait if you want to punish it with anything. I’ve rarely seen any Poison players actually use this move though.
Her normals are okay, nothing to write home about. Used in tandem with the fireball is where they shine, but if you can keep the FB in check with the trade game and Ultra, you should be fine. Super punish whatever is -2 or higher as usual.
I’ve been working on seeing how much damage I can get out of red focus after seing the Mix, Stun, Die CMV. This is what Ive come up with. Any input would be appreciated.
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jf.hp tc, cl.st.hk xx hk legs (0 inputs), rfa, cr.lp, cl.st.hk xx (reset)
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hk hazanshu, cr.lk, ex legs, ultra 1
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30%/321 dmg/10 hits/562 stun
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54%/479 dmg/26 hits/370 stun
Total) 800 dmg/36 hits/932 stun
Alternate (from mid screen)
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jf.hp tc, cl.st.hk xx hk legs (0 inputs), rfa, cr.lp, cl.st.hk xx (reset)
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hk hazanshu,
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cr.mk, ex legs, dizzy, jf.hp tc, bfu.mk tc, ex sbk, ultra (1/2)
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30%/321 dmg/10 hits/562 stun
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100%/130 dmg/1 hit/200 stun
3a) 100%/180 dmg/4 hits/250 stun
3b) 7%/ 416 dmg/28 hits/1012 stun
3c) 7%/ 415 dmg/37 hits/ 1012 stun
Total) 867~866 dmg/ 48~39 hits/ 1012 stun
3a = damage at dizzy. Part of 3b & 3c.
3b = ultra 1. 3c = ultra 2
I would be scared to risk 3 bars for a punish that isn’t guaranteed if hazanshu doesn’t hit. Ahh.
It does seem very risky to spend 3-5(!) meter on this maneuver. The gamble is pretty bad considering the opponent can block reactively, and I don’t see a lot of mix-up potential. I would stick with the stun combos I posted a page or two back, personally.
Also, are you sure Neutral Jump HP or J. HK (depending on matchup) then straight into Ultra after the stun aren’t more damaging than the B+MK target combo? Pretty cool, but seems more style than substance.
The whole thing is impractical but i have actually used some of it in a match. But again, i was just seeing how much damage i could do. Also, focus attack is a great way to get the setup rolling.
Absolutely it’s feasible in a real match, given you land it (hazanshu), but super easy to block for the opponent if they have a modicum of common sense.
Unblockable OS (or reaction) setup on Cammy and Decapre: F. Throw -> Dash -> J. MK [buffer backdash] -> EX Legs
If the j.mk hit’s you’ll combo into EX Legs. If they delayed wake up you’ll backdash and the EX Legs can whiff punish a throw whiff (most people like to throw after delay wakeup) or reversal pyscho sting.
You can most likely just react to the technical message by backdashing as well and decide what you want to do after.
How are the rest of you dealing with the Poison matchup?
Right now it feels liks the only viable option is laming it out with fireballs aiming for time-outs.
^
I’m having issues with this too. I hate having to rely on turtle mode but its the only way I’ve been winning against Poison. That and I’ve only been coming across people who are still learning with her.
Can someone post some higher level match vids of this? (sorry, being lazy to look it up myself at the moment)
I saw an online Decapre escape this with Scramble… =/
There is definitely plenty of time after seeing the reversal message to not press mk and land with a little less lag. It comes out a little less than 15f, I guess, since some people think they can react by the time dash forward ends. I tend to land with cr. lk if I see the technical, but there is probably time to focus backdash. I’ll have to check how meaty the timing is… Maybe instant over-heads would add a bit of damage to the mixup. Too bad this set-up isnt safe on Yun/Viper…
Lame sounds about right… Both characters have the ability to make the other’s offense pretty weak. Poison is negative on block from all of her non-ex specials. Chun is stronger up close, though since she has better frame advantage, but Poisons conversions into damaging knockdowns (rekka) are better… as long as Chun doesn’t get jabbed out, she doesnt have too much to worry about. her flip kick takes a long time to be airborn, so it is not a useful reversal. Also trading a heavy with DP is arguably in Chuns favor.
-4 or more from rekkas, and she doesn’t have the ability to frame trap as good as Fei. Her flip kick is -1 on block, so she will throw, DP, or backdash after that…
She is tough to ultra I punish because of her slow start-fast recover fireball… Same with hasanshu reaction. She might be weaker to ultra II reactions to her fireball, but she protects a lot of space with love me tender (her flip kick). Then again, her walk speed is not as good as chun by a long shot so she will have to use a special, jump or back off more often than Chun. Chun has more options to wall her into the corner since Poison can be anti-aired easily and she has to use ex to have safe offense.
Her ex is very good so possibly a good strat besides time out is to get her to waste meter before going on offense. She will have a tough time anti airing certain angle jumps after a fireball, since her only good dp is ex. She has trade set-ups with non-ex dp, but those will be harder to achieve against head aimed jumps. The invincibility on her non ex DP protects only her first hit-box, which has the same range as a cr. lk. Not the best hitbox for a “dp” to have. … then again, considering that, it is stronger against hasanshu than it would be against a jump in.