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Heres a video I edited together that displays some of boxers combos and how to land more hits when going for headbutt>ultra. All of the video is of the player Aojiru from the game sakura vids.
Just want to clarify so I don’t go down to the arcade today and try the wrong thing.
so with headbutt to ultra
does it matter if you start it with ppp or kkk ?
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is there any specific timing you need to be pressing kkk after the ultra starts to get the rush uppers for the juggle or can you just piano or mash the shit out of it marvel style ?
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one last thing. is doing crouch forward to headbutt a link or a regular ol combo?
real quick answers:
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you “start” the ultra with PPP ie: b,f,b,f+PPP. then during the ultra, hold any K to get the uppers. The reason I wrote hold all KKK was to eliminate any room for error. Uppers = useful for juggling
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some people like to piano it. i personally will hold KKK during the “flash” screen of the ultra (ie immediately after)
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i haven’t been able to CANCEL cr foward into any special to save my life, so if it does combo, it is a link. however instead I suggest you use cr jab or cr strong to combo into headbutt
have fun at the arcade! i’ve been dying to get my fix in this week but i am getting owned up with overtime at work. sigh.
I haven’t played IV yet, but Jesus… 3 different ways of passing through projectiles? Awesome! :tup:
I usually use jabs to combo into headbutt other than overhead dashpunch comboed into duck short into headbutt, mainly just lookin for possible links to add more damage other than duck jab > duck strong etc etc. I went down today and had no problem comboing ultra mashing kicks marvel style so I think it really doesn’t matter which way you do it.
When I get some time soon I’ll add some info to this thread regarding matchup specific things, basic strategies etc etc. We have a pretty competitive scene so far in Austin with a surprisingly diverse character selection. Needless to say we have everything from gief players down to good dhalsim players.
i would love to learn more about e honda boxer matchup
By the sounds of it the best way to combo into headbutt from a jump in attack is off a single c.strong. For the ground c.Foward linked into c.strong cancelled to headbutt will give the most damage I assume. I don’t if you have seen this but here is the damage scaling for combos as posted by Reno:
Combo Scaling
This is how combo damage scales in SFIV… easy to remember this one.
1st hit - 100%
2nd hit - 100%
3rd hit - 80%
4th hit - 70%
5th hit - 60%
6th hit - 50%
7th hit - 40%
8th hit - 30%
9th hit - 20%
10th hit and over - 10%
I think im gonna ditch comboing multiple c.jabs cos that scaling is pretty steep.
Same I get eaten alive by honda he too strong. Things ive learnt is to save your super meter. I think ex moves are only good for escaping honda mixup games on your wakeup and using ex overhead. If you have super meter you can punish blocked headbutts with jab rush canceled into super. I don’t mind playing footsies with honda either c.rounhouse is good for punishing his slow whiffed moves
my jumpin moves whiff over his shortness.
i just played him today for the first time.
Hey Jay some combos you want to include in your offense post
Overhead Rush Punch [link] c.short xx Headbutt [link] Super/Ultra
In the corner SA crumple > Dash > s.roundhouse [link] s.jab xx Ex Rush Upper [link] c.jabx2 xx headbutt as seen here http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm4825164 at around the 12:15 mark.
Thnx for the post, I will add the combos to the list.
Anyways, even though I don’t read/speak any Japanese, I ordered the Japanese SF4 “mook” (strategy guide) off Amazon Japan. When it arrives, I will try my best post up frame data for all of Rog’s moves (we’ll see how that works out).
The next time I go to arcade, I really want to test out some new things such as (maybe you guys can help too!) :
- charge partioning
- cancelling an ultra from an EX move, if it even exists (aka “armour cancel”, see post: http://forums.shoryuken.com/showpost.php?p=5590561&postcount=94 )
- “counterhit” traps/setups (frame data will really help this)
Sorry, I will correct the first post so that it is a bit more clear:
The EX moves don’t “pass through”. Instead a more accurate term would be “absorb”.
With the single (1) hit that you “absorb”, full damage is taken in the form of “grey” or “recoverable” damage (the same as if you did a SA).
However the positive side of it is that your move will continue to execute (given that you are not hit a second time)
The most useful application of this is obviously with fireballs as they have always given Rog problems in the past. It just gives you more options!
On the other hand, the TAP can pass through fireballs and other normals because of it’s invincibility frames on start up. The timing is a bit more strict compare to other games in the past but in SF4, you can release PPP or KKK right before the fb hits you and you pass through.
TAP is extremely useful agasin’t shotos and other fireballers. It allows you to build pressure, zone and move forward with a rush punch move but without having to sit on down/back all day.
If you do a TAP at the right spacing (Rog finishes the TAP at about a character’s width or further) you will have frame advantage.That means you if you anticipate your opponent to stick out a poke, you can punish them with a headbutt, super, ultra, SA, etc.
Ronstoppable or Xnoy Hoy does uses this trick in his matches (see Rog Video Thread!) by doing EX headbutt after TAP.
As for playing on console with pad, you can “cheat” by setting one of the trigger buttons to PPP or KKK. But I would recommend buying a stick and learning to play the “honorable” way. :o
how do you play sf4 with a pad? do the cabinets have a controller port? we have ghettp modded normal cabinets
they aren’t even hd
Dam Valle is showing everyone how to beat boxer…
any shoto hurricane kick > tap
i have been tapping a lot after rush punches lately so thats what i deserve :annoy:
I don’t play SF4 with anything. Once the console release comes I’ll be using pad.
TAP’s are only good on rare occasions, it should not be relied upon, neither should buffalo headbutt. For all intents and purposes TAPs are only good for going for close thrown projectiles, baiting various things from MAX range TAP… and I stress MAX range… never do a tap up close unless you know for sure your going to hit with it a.k.a… character does a duck jab linked into a duck strong all the time and doesn’t mix up you can punish the linked duck strong on block with a tap which will counterhit and you can link duck short > headbutt. Most of the time your better rewarded by waiting and punishing with duck jab > link duck strong > lower rush punch for no quick get up. This puts you in a perfect position to land a jump roundhouse so meaty your oponent will be forced to block. From there you have a plethora of options :
- Throw
- block string > throw
- block string > overhead
- just plain ex overhead
- jab,jab,jab,strong > bait with TAP ( I don’t do this very often )
- duck forward which beats a lot of normals
- block string > walk forward > low forward ( if it hits then link duck strong )
a. knock down with lower rush and etc etc
b.overhead rush punch is a very good option after this, I generally almost always get it , especially if I have my opponent scared. - Jump straight up Wiggle punch, then re-evaluate your options
Basically, he’s not super turbo balrog so mindless rushdown will not work. You have to be more patient and only rushdown when you have the momentum to do so.
forgot to mention, if that meaty jump roundhouse hits, you have no reason to not combo duck strong into lower rush… unless you have ultra… and that ultra can kill them. Lower rush is probably balrogs biggest asset since they can’t quick recover.
as for honda… LOTS O PATIENCE
keep him spaced out with whatever method you deem necessary atm, you can use the following
- MAX MAX MAX MAX range jab upper dash punch… anything not max range will get you punished
- don’t jump at him unless it’s with previous mentioned meaty jump RH and only meaty
- to reiterate… don’t try to beat him air to air
- don’t let him knock you down… that will lead into ochio setups and get you scared where you will mess up headbutts which will get you eaten alive
- EXTREME MAX range TAP’s can be effective and lead into nasty frame traps which can give you the momentum to rush down
- Standing Fierce isn’t all that bad in this matchup; , use it sparringly though.
- Try to land as many tick throw setups you can, this will frustrate your opponent and as soon as they seem frustrated go balls mixup on them, you can generally land overheads like no other. The key is to not predictable when you obtain said momentum.
- I probably wouldn’t try block strings into intentionally whiffed upper kick rush for throws, it works sometimes, but honda can EX ochio or mash handslap
If i can think of anything else Ill post it up
Yea I hadn’t seen the numbers yet but I had a hunch that it was similar to this after playing for about a week with balrog. I pretty much resign myself to only using duck jab > duck strong ( something something ) because if you do JAB JAB JAB JAB JAB then rush punch the damage scales shitty. Also if you notice… OH dash punch > link short > headbutt does TON of dmg which obviously coincides with this handy chart above.
I usually try to get some gauge build vs shotos to EX through fireballs, so cr.lpx3 dashpunch/[BHB TAP(wiff)] works for me. for chars with no fireball, i use the cr.jab cr.strong dashpunch/BHB for damage. I like having EX in stock just for safty, damage comes one way or another, but i would say i use both at 50/50 to sufice all.
Balrogs always been a shoto killer, that hasn’t changed much. Ex’ing through fireballs is an outright waste of meter unless it’s going to kill your opponent. It’s perfectly safe to jump a long range fireball and stuff their next attempt ( and theres a lot of things you can stuff the opening frames of a projectile with rog) if they are stupid enough to throw another one. Also not to mention the fact that if they throw a mid or close range fireball that’s a free TAP, stupid close fireball attempts are better jumped and go for that jump RH, or you could be super minimalist and just headbutt . Save EX meter for rushdowns with standing kick rush punch EX ver. since it has literally no recovery and if it hits you can link afterwards. IMO the only two good EX moves balrog has are
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OH ex rush punch for obvious reasons
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Standing kick rush punch ( for previously stated reasons )
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I could add EX headbutt to this list for simply stuffing non comboed ultras ( a.k.a ryu players who actually think they are going to chip you with that ultra or super fireball ( lawlz ) )but I’m about 99% sure regular fierce headbutt would do exactly the same thing as the Invincibility on EX headbutt doesn’t seem that much longer.