I think the problem with the Ultras is that they were clearly intended to allow a comeback, and even things out when one fighter is doing a lot worse. The problem is the stronger characters also have the stronger ultras (Sagat, Zangeif, Rufus), or the most ways to combo into them (Ryu).
I also think the chip damage from Blanka’s is ridiculous but that probably depends on who he’s up against.
Then you get harder to perform or combo into ultras like Vega and Guile, or ultras that can push you out if spaced wrong like Chun Li or Fei Long. So if you have one of them up against a Sagat or Ryu, then what was meant to even things out a little puts them at even more of a disadvantage. The ultras would have worked better if it the Ultra was stronger for weak characters or those that can’t combo into it, and weaker for the strong characters or those with several combo options.
I solved the shortcut problem by only playing charge characters who aren’t M.Bison. I was gonna use Cammy, Dan, or Sakura - so really, it was for my own good.
Only gripes I have with SF4 right now is the silly autoguard which makes reversals so easy to pull off since you can basically just mash all day while someone is doing a combo. I have no idea why they decided to put this feature in the game, it’s horrible.
Shortcuts should go too, the real motions aren’t so hard to do after some practice that they’re actually needed. Better for the franchise if they would’ve just kept them out. Now they have to keep putting in these stupid shortcuts in every SF released. Unless they decide to drop them in the next one (fingers crossed).
Yes, how annoying is it to be spded or dped when missing a link combo when the other guy is just spinning the stick. When you hit a button or your stick leaves db or b, you should stop blocking.
Shortcuts actually make me do air tatsu occasionally by accident. Unfortunately I’ve never gotten a lucky crossup from this.
Overall though, I feel these are just minor annoyances. They don’t take too much away from my enjoyment of the game. If they actually help newcomers a lot, that means we have more people to play with making the game last longer.
As mentioned, it does not make sense that there are easy to land ultras that do big damage, and hard to land ultras that do crap damage.
Ultra juggling is also pretty stupid when you have ultras that lock on for full damage, and other ultras that whiff most of the hits if the opponent is in the air.
One side effect of ultras that no one mentions is that it often overlaps with Supers. Some characters supers are just never used partly because of that reason (but usually because EX moves are better).
Damage reduction:
Damage scaling is necessary otherwise hit confirmation will be too powerful. But it does benefit the hard hitters. This is a hard one.
Damage reduction also applies as your health decreases. What is the point of that? It just makes damage calculation unnecessarily confusing.
Probably just finished watching an episode of Boston legal…
As for the gameplay mechanics, I know that Ono felt 3S was too much of a ‘secret club’ game that was so technical and dependent on total obsession on learning. This SF was for the masses, and as many have stated in previous posts(and to quote commisioner Gordon), it may not be the game we want, but it’s the one we need. What I mean is that though it may feel like easy mode on so many levels (auto-correct, easy inputs, sagat and ryu), it did rake in so much dough that it will ensure future iterations. These versions may work their way back to less leniency for inputs and all the stuff hardcore players feel they’ve sacrificed years to master…but in order to fund them we need to take SOMEONE’S fight money, right? Capcom decided to take it from the masses and make them feel good by providing the illusion that they could stamdtoe to toe with the SF veterans (but we all know they can’t…shhhhh).
I do not think SF IV is the specific game toward the masses.SF will probably not go back to being a time investment on the level of SF III where you had to learn how to parry most move.
You think Capcom will be happy with SF IV selling like 3+ million and go back to making niche SF title? Expect every future SF to be accessible and as casual friendly as possible as Capcom isn’t really interested in making that many niche title anymore.
Look at the changing philosophy of Capcom in the last few years.Dropping the talented but niche studio clover(viewtful joe,god hand,Okami).Making game with more and more western appeal and dropping most niche franchise(power stone,dark stalker,dino crisis,breath of fire,maximo,etc) to focus on those who can sell million of copies(lost planet,devil may cry,RE,SF,Dead rising,etc).Making SF mainstream again and trying their hands at shooters.RE 5 is heavily influenced by Gears of War and thus it became the best selling in the franchise,etc.
Well, I get where you’re coming from and I agree, I dont see them immediately or abruptly reverting to the niche they somehow whittled down from the initial WW fanbase. What I do see is them maybe tweaking/tightening up inputs and treating SFIV as a ‘gateway fighter’ that gets people (re)hooked on that sweet sweet SF candy. Now that they’ve regained their fanbase, they can maybe ramp the difficulty and input up just a bit, slowly getting to some place in the middle that both newcomers and vets can feel comfortable with (because face it, only the players who’ve played for years have a problem with this stuff…you don’t hear the newbs complaining that the moves are too easy. Partly because they’ve had no prior experience with the SRK motions and SF mechanics that we’ve all engrained into muscle memory).
Maybe the next iterations can have a toggle that turns auto-correct and easy inputs on and off? Why they weren’t included in this version is probably the same reason bonus games weren’t included…time constraints.
Honestly, the only thing that bugs me about the ultra system is that you get a chance every round to make up for the rape you had dealt to you. If this was per match and not per round, that would make more sense. I think if they made ultras function like supers, where you retain the meter throughout the match, but toned down how fast you accumulate it (at least by half if we’re to do it this way) that it would be a much better mechanic. Imagine an epic comeback in the third round of a set because the guy saves his ultra just for the right moment…! Yet at the same time, the opponent will know that he is packin heat when the round starts, so he’s going to be very careful. It’s perfect IMO.
Now that they have a very good SF fanbase again,they can ramp up the complexity in some area.I expect the motion shortcuts to eventually go away and the ultra system will probably be dropped for SF V.
I can see Capcom transforming SF into the 2.5D Tekken.Each new Tekken sell million of copies with slight changes to the core system(based around combo and juggling) and a bigger roster of characters.It’s casual friendly and it does have a lot of fluff+nice gimmicks and a console exclusive single player mode.Part of the reason for the success is also the various martial arts displayed which is the reason why I buy each new one.I’m a sucker for capoeira and tae kwon do or Steve Fox unorthodox boxing style :wonder:
I don’t think it’s a bad thing,as Tekken 6 BR(Tekken 5 also dominated) is the most lucrative arcade around and I expect the home version to be the best selling fighting game outside of smash bros.It simply mean that SF will keep selling even if it’s dumbed down or more casual friendly.It’s much more important for Capcom to get excellent mainstream press and the cash than making a timeless classic like third strike with virtually no profit to show for it.
I don’t think the problem is the shortcuts. The problem is the window to register the inputs. I’m fine with Df, Df shortcut, what I hate is that if you do Df, D, Df, f you still get a srk instead of an hadouken.
For me this should be addressed.
Another thing I deslike is the Focus Attack. I would prefer it not to crumble. It could have different Hit Advantages and damage for the 3 levels, level 3 impossible to block, would crumble on counter hit and disadvantage on block (after the dash).
I might be so rubbish and getting it doubly wrong…but…i get the feeling that if im being crossed up and i anticipate the correct dp direction, it gets switched and i end up missing it altogether ie. im p1 side, he jumps over to cross up my left side, i DP motion left, but character dp’s right and fuking whiffs.
doesnt happen all the time, i swear its to do with whether they have passed the middle of you before you start inputing or not…any thoughts??
sorry if this is just wrong, i could just be too shit…
anyway, that, and the mad short cuts should go (3/4 rotation for spd style and df,d,df DPs are ok i think). Also tighten up the input window so walking hados dont need so much waiting (“just go f (walk) db,d,df,f” cry all…yeh but thats just artificial wait…(i understand that in all street fighters if you do a fast enough walking it hado gives you DP))
as per the damage scaling. i think its needed, but needs to be implemented better (see someones earlier argument about weaker characters being unfairly treated by it, ie weaker characters should be able to string more together without scaling)
apart from that which should be cleared up in the CE edition, this game fking roks and is a fine way to get the masses back in. This weekend however is dedicated to blazblue and mvc2, just to see what they are like…
There weren’t any tell-tale signs or anything, I’d just been thinking about how fighting games can be attractive to ASD teens and was in something of a spontaneous mood at the time.
Your first post had you repeat your defensive state on your assertion or ability, and that made me consider if I should ask… for some reason.
The problem I find with the Ultra mechanic is it promotes turtling. As soon as I bring a shoto down to low hp, I can be sure they’re gonna hide in the corner throw fireballs and wait for a chance to QCFx2 and mash whatever the triple punch/kick button is and get off there impossibly easy to hit ultra. Which leaves me rolling/dashing all over the map(Abel) trying to catch them. Gouki/Seth players are even worse with teleport.
Maybe they could counter this, by it starting to diminish while you take no damage/do no damage.
